1989 ZR-1 Pilot #004 Thread

[1989ZR1#74]

I thought I would start a new thread covering the status, update, and documenting of 89 #004. For information on the auction or previous found data click here:

http://www.zr1.net/forum/showthread.php?t=10927


Lots of updates today. Put a new battery in, out the passenger tire back on. Replaced the driverside tire with the a 91 rim that came with #74. Still need to resolve the flat gator back.

First things first. Found a partial stamping on the oil pan boss when changing the tire:

http://www.syreal.com/mmstamp.jpg

When I connected the battery she started showing signs of life:

http://www.syreal.com/infoclust.JPG

But I now know why the Odometer is under reporting the miles...

http://www.syreal.com/wrongtach.JPG

Not sure maybe the 8000RPM dash wasn't ready yet, but I doubt that.

Eric

[1989ZR1#74]

LT-5 from passenger side:
http://www.syreal.com/lt5pass.jpg




LT-5 from drivers side:

http://www.syreal.com/lt5driver.JPG

[1989ZR1#74]

Restoring some dignity to the old girl:

http://www.syreal.com/004pass.jpg

Driverside with 91 wheel

http://www.syreal.com/004driver.JPG

Lights work.. (most of them anyway)

http://www.syreal.com/004lights.JPG

[DMark]

TAG! :wave:

[Jeffvette]

Sucks on the cluster. There was a guy selling one for about 5k a couple of years ago.


Like seeing the progress pics. Extremely cool.

[1989ZR1#74]

Electrical Systems check on battery install:

1. Wipers work all settings
2. Both power windows roll up and down
3. Door chime works
4. Door ajdar works.
5. Radio works, but not through all speakers.
6. Power antenna works.
7. Dome/courtesy lights work and time off delay works.
8. Headlights work, drivers side amber light doesn't.
9. Power mirrors work. both drivers and passenger side
10. Dash information functions for Trip odo and Volts.
11. Dash information displays "Err" on Oil Pressure, Coolant Temp, Range, Instant MPG.

http://www.syreal.com/dasherror.JPG

http://www.syreal.com/dashtrip.jpg

[scholtmj]

Cool looking PCV and TB coolant lines! :happy1:

[Jeffvette]

Eric, I'll look and see if I can find the ad.

You were in the post..... http://forums.*************.com/c4-parts-for-sale-wanted/2227262-89-zr1-instrument-cluster-8-000-rpm-tach.html

http://www.pnwzr1.com/images/1989cluster.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

That's the cluster out of #75. I traded emails with the guy back when he had it up on ebay and forsale on cf. Was selling the console armrest with SPI as well. #75 is reported by carfax as destroyed at a salvage yard in MI.

I need to find out if the 8K was in the pilot. There is a ton of things different between #004 and #074 so I am hoping!.

[1989ZR1#74]

Front tires/wheel dates

Passenger Tire Date: 028 2nd Week (January) of 1988
Passenger Wheel Date: 02/29/88 Leap Year!
Drivers Tire Date: 098 9th Week (February) of 1988
Drivers Wheel Date: 01/29/88

These match with the assumption that this ZR-1 was assembled in 3/88

[Jeffvette]

10. Dash information displays "Err" on Oil Pressure, Coolant Temp, Range, Instant MPG.

http://www.syreal.com/dasherror.JPG

Might have a circuit board issue going on there. A connector undone.I've got an 85 halfway ripped apart if you want to borrow a known good cluster.

[1989ZR1#74]

I appreciate that. There is a lot of loose wires under the drivers side dash. I am not to worried.. (yet!) I won't get to that for awhile.

[1989ZR1#74]

Prototype Electronic Spark Control Module.

http://www.syreal.com/protosm.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

More Electrical Checks:

1. Tail lights work
2. Brake lights work, including all bulbs in 3rd
3. Power locks, only drivers side works.
4. Oil pressure gauge now shows zero.

It Appears that the ignition switch cylinder is loose or not engaging the starter correctly. I don't want to try too much before we can properly prep the car for 1st start.

[1989ZR1#74]

Found this in the rear cargo box, under the plastic liner:

http://www.syreal.com/plugbag.jpg

Had 8 AC FR1L (no S) Plugs in it.

[GOLDCYLON]

More Electrical Checks:

4. Oil pressure gauge now shows zero.


No surprise that sending unit should be right next to the oil filter. I have a special socket that you can borrow to use to remove it and the sending unit is available at checker and autozone. :mrgreen:

[1989ZR1#74]

No surprise that sending unit should be right next to the oil filter. I have a special socket that you can borrow to use to remove it and the sending unit is available at checker and autozone. :mrgreen:

Not sure if it works or not yet. before it read zero it read Err. I'll let you know.

[-=Jeff=-]

This is cool!!

I have to wonder if the data on the serial line tot he dash is different from L98 to LT5... That would cause the Err if it was

[1989ZR1#74]

This is cool!!

I have to wonder if the data on the serial line tot he dash is different from L98 to LT5... That would cause the Err if it was

Jeff, My bet is the data isn't present. The wiring under the dash is in disarray. It looks like someone who did not know what they were doing tried to fix either a VATS issu, a bad clutch engage wire, or bad ignition switch. So who know what I'll find when I get back there. Glad I have the 89 wiring diagram. Eric

[LGAFF]

Jeff, My bet is the data isn't present. The wiring under the dash is in disarray. It looks like someone who did not know what they were doing tried to fix either a VATS issu, a bad clutch engage wire, or bad ignition switch. So who know what I'll find when I get back there. Glad I have the 89 wiring diagram. Eric

Dare you to call Craig Jackson and ask for a partial refund. :cheers:

[1989ZR1#74]

Yeah right. I think this happened either at the Heritage Center or at the trade school. It looks like someone tried to get it going. There's a newer oil filter on it, a newer battery etc. So I don't blame Craig for that one.

[Ccmano]

Interesting that it has the late version cam cover emblems (91-95) Could mean something, could mean nothing?:happy1:

H
:cheers:



LT-5 from passenger side:
http://www.syreal.com/lt5pass.jpg




LT-5 from drivers side:

http://www.syreal.com/lt5driver.JPG

[1989ZR1#74]

Interesting that it has the late version cam cover emblems (93-95) Could mean something, could mean nothing?:happy1:

H
:cheers:

It was built before 3/22/88 so it would have originally had a phase 3 LT-5. According to "The Heart of The Beast" They did not have the cover medallion finalized. The heads are 10106179s.


http://www.syreal.com/drvhead.jpg

[bdw18_123]

This is an extremely interesting thread!

Especially seeing up close the differences in the PCV system (only one PCV valve!) and the coolant lines coming off the plenum are all metal instead of having some rubber sections like the production Z's have. The line at the back of the plenum where the brake booster line connects is different too, the metal section is longer and has a mounting bracket on it. Is the coolant piping under the air-horn any different? Could we get a picture of that area?

I was wondering about the cam cover emblems as well. But if the emblems weren't finalized at the time they put the car together, it probably never had emblems to begin with. Then, years later (maybe someone at the trade school) stuck some '91-'95 production emblems on it. They should have put the '90 emblems on it. Or maybe having no emblems would be more correct.

[1989ZR1#74]

Not to downplay the the Sheridan Vocational Technical Center ("Sheridan"), but I see little evidence that they did anything to the car. I doubt they added emblems. In fact it appears to have lost the nose emblem and the ZR-1/LT5 bumper emblem when it was in their care. (Which I guess to be about 10 years 1995 to 2006)

I have a feeling that this car was a "PEP" car, as discussed in the other thread, and I would suspect that at that time the emblems would have been added. What level 8 or above manager would pop the hood on his company ZR-1 and have a missing medalion? Perhaps Sheridan painted the car, but they didn't do engine work to it since they could not drive it, run it etc. In fact there is a black oil filter on the LT-5 when Tyler took pictures of it in 2006. Now there's a blue service filter.


"Is the coolant piping under the air-horn any different?" I'll go check.. Pics soon. Eric

[phrogs]

Interesting that it has the late version cam cover emblems (91-95) Could mean something, could mean nothing?:happy1:

H
:cheers:



Don't think it means anything since they were probably put on the car well after 91

[1989ZR1#74]

http://www.syreal.com/cooling1.jpg

http://www.syreal.com/cooling2.jpg

http://www.syreal.com/steer.jpg

[BOB HDZ]

my 89 active suspension motor doesnt have any emblems ! but you could not see them anyways if they did!http://cid-374bdaad44e8964f.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/zr-1/IMG%5E_0965.JPG

[1989ZR1#74]

my 89 active suspension motor doesnt have any emblems ! but you could not see them anyways if they did!http://cid-374bdaad44e8964f.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/zr-1/IMG%5E_0965.JPG

Cool picture. #074 has emblems. Do you know what vin the motor came from? #18 to #32 range?

Eric

[Kevin]

this car is so awesome

[1989ZR1#74]

my 89 active suspension motor doesnt have any emblems ! but you could not see them anyways if they did!http://cid-374bdaad44e8964f.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/zr-1/IMG%5E_0965.JPG


http://www.syreal.com/img_0965.jpg

[-=Jeff=-]

http://www.syreal.com/cooling1.jpg

http://www.syreal.com/cooling2.jpg

http://www.syreal.com/steer.jpg

the Orange and White wires are for the floor light that is in the hush panel.

As for the steering wheel, I have a Brand New in the package Emblem for that Horn button

[BOB HDZ]

mine is #28

[LGAFF]

If you think about it, that has to be the original tach if miles are correct, as you know its a 1 piece unit.

[jrd1990zr1]

Eric,

This is a fantastic thread. I hope you will continue it.

Thanks

[Jeffvette]

If you think about it, that has to be the original tach if miles are correct, as you know its a 1 piece unit.

Lee, the odo can be removed from the 84-89 cluster.

[-=Jeff=-]

Lee, the odo can be removed from the 84-89 cluster.
:iamwithst Yeah what he said

[1989ZR1#74]

If you think about it, that has to be the original tach if miles are correct, as you know its a 1 piece unit.


Well I have had my doubts about 344 miles. The front tires appear original and match date code wise. They look like they have more or less 5k mi on them. So I suspected the ODO was not right from the get go. It is still a low mile car from the clutch pedal/brake pedal wear and seat wear. I knew the electro mechanical odo can be/has to be changeable, but I guess they forgot on this one.

[1989ZR1#74]

the Orange and White wires are for the floor light that is in the hush panel.

As for the steering wheel, I have a Brand New in the package Emblem for that Horn button


Cool, I found the molex plug and the kick/hush panel when I emptied the hatch. I have not started looking into the rest of the wiring yet. Sort of hear no evil see no evil. That horn button came off my L98 89 when I redid the interior a couple of years ago. Picked up the horn contact and wire on ebay for a couple of bucks. I knew I saved the old one for a reason! When I start really cleaning it up I'll PM you.

[1989ZR1#74]

mine is #28
Neat. Do you know where the rest of it went? What is the date stamp on the engine? I have a hunch and that info will fill in a gap for me (the date that is)

[1989ZR1#74]

Tyler just emailed that the he thinks #004 went to the trade school in 1990.

[1989ZR1#74]

Found a reference to the ZR-1 at Sheridan Votech Center from the February 20, 1992 edition of the Miami Herald:


"The Sheridan Vocational-Technical Center in Hollywood held its third annual open house Feb. 10 and 11 for its automotive program. The open house was in recognition of National Vocational Education week, Feb. 10 to 15. General Motors and Ford provided demonstrations on these automotive topics during the open house: super and turbo charging, 375 horsepower ZR-1 Corvette, computerized shifted transmission, Freon-recycling, distributorless ignition system, air-bag deployment and certification legislation. "

[Corvettes White]

But I now know why the Odometer is under reporting the miles...

http://www.syreal.com/wrongtach.JPG

Not sure maybe the 8000RPM dash wasn't ready yet, but I doubt that.

Eric

Question for you. What is the squareish circle inside the circle in the middle of the photograph? just above the digits? It looks like part of the cluster, but never seen it before on an 8000 rpm dash nor on a 6000 dash. When I look in the owners handbook is shows in some of the small graphics and not in others. thanks, George

[Jeffvette]

Question for you. What is the squareish circle inside the circle in the middle of the photograph? just above the digits? It looks like part of the cluster, but never seen it before. thanks, George


Overdrive light for a 4+3 manual 84-88 car, since that is what the cluster came out of.

[LGAFF]

Is there an RPO code sheet on the bottom of the center console door?

[1989ZR1#74]

Is there an RPO code sheet on the bottom of the center console door?


The SPI is there and intact. Will post a picture of it tomorrow.

[Corvettes White]

Overdrive light for a 4+3 manual 84-88 car, since that is what the cluster came out of.

Thanks Jeff.

[LGAFF]

Often on C4s you can faintly see the assembly date written on the underside of the hood, its towards the front of the hood on the D/S. Usually written in a white pen, almost looks like wax.

[XfireZ51]

Often on C4s you can faintly see the assembly date written on the underside of the hood, its towards the front of the hood on the D/S. Usually written in a white pen, almost looks like wax.

Mine said June 6th I believe

[Tyler Townsley]

Been involved in a little car show for the last week or so and misssed the tread. Someone has swaped out the dash cluster with a stock unit, it had a ZR-1 unit on it when I saw it and 270 miles so it is over reporting the actual mileage. I suspect it was done at the heritage center and maybe they know where the original unit is. The ERR code can only be fixed by sending it off. I had to have mine fixed as there are some solder spots that will go bad after a time. Aparently the ckt board welder had it problems.

The early DIS module had problems so you might want to check it. Best way is to pull all the plugs connect them to the wires and lay them on the plenum. Crank the car and watch the spark acrosss the pulgs. There should be a rythem to the flashes, if there is not then the dis module may be bad.

They also displayed the car at some of the Miami International car shows. It was at one of those events that they were offered $250 k for the car.

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Morning update:

No sign of grease pencil under hood that I could find. More electrical testing:

1. Passenger side blinkers work.
2. Drivers side lights up but does not blink
3. Passneger side door hatch release works
4. Drivers side door hatch release doesnt work
5. Center console hatch release works.
6. New installed horn button works.
7. Only high pitch horn works.
8. High beams work
9. Green arrows do not light on dash when either blinker is on
10. High beam indicator on dash does not light up.

[1989ZR1#74]

I emailed Sean Finegan from GM this morning to look into the tach issue. Sean was the GM rep at the Auction and he helped me document #074 last year. He replied back and said he would see what he can find.

[1989ZR1#74]

http://www.syreal.com/powerkeysm.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

Checked the Ignitian today to see if the VATS resistor is working. It was:

http://www.syreal.com/vatscheck1.JPG

Key is a 4 and the vats check reads:

http://www.syreal.com/vatscheck2.JPG

Since that works now I may try the 4 minute start option just to see if maybe the key is wrong.

[1989ZR1#74]

Pulled the drivers door panel to fix the hatch release and repair the upper trim. Found the original color:

http://www.syreal.com/driverdoor.JPG


Any idea what this resistor is for?

Pulled this plug off of the break pedal:

http://www.syreal.com/clutchplug.JPG

[1989ZR1#74]

Update:

Put the Tech 1 on it this afternoon and guess what.....

Code 46!!! Vats problem

Here is my question. Where is the VATs code stored? in the ECM? If so this has a refurbished ECM. So...

[-=Jeff=-]

in a regular RPO there is a VATS Module on the Passenger side that controls it. there is a flag in the ECM on the 89 L98 to ignore the VATS.

My guess is the vats module is the same on your behind the breadbox

[Tyler Townsley]

in a regular RPO there is a VATS Module on the Passenger side that controls it. there is a flag in the ECM on the 89 L98 to ignore the VATS.

My guess is the vats module is the same on your behind the breadbox

Eric you can change the code in the calibration to ignore the vats. Either I or Todd P can do it. Check around and see if anyone there can download your calibration from the prom and send it to either of us and then can reflash it when you get the new calibration back. Other option is to send us the calibration module.

There is a tool that can bypass/check the vats its called a vats checker, I used one on mine when we could not get it started.

Tyler

[Tyler Townsley]

Any idea what this resistor is for?

Pulled this plug off of the break pedal:

http://www.syreal.com/clutchplug.JPG

Looks like a way to solve the dreaded no start caused by the clutch start switch which is way too small to handle the amperage it carries, its what I mentioned earlier about jumpering around. Under the hush panel on the drivers side jump the purple wires that go to the switch. It will turn over in gear but at least it will turn over.

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Thanks for the info. I did not want to start with the wiring yet, but this afternoon I reattached the courtesy light plug connectors to the white and orange wires. Next thing you know. I'm pulling codes.

[Tyler Townsley]

I emailed Sean Finegan from GM this morning to look into the tach issue. Sean was the GM rep at the Auction and he helped me document #074 last year. He replied back and said he would see what he can find.

Ask him if they tried to start the car, if they did and it would not start ask what they replaced. In trying to start my car I used a 90 DIS module and it wiped out the dash cluster as you discribe yours. This is because the 89 and 90 DIS modules are different on the tach line and dis in lines. It will cause problems in the cluster.

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Ask him if they tried to start the car, if they did and it would not start ask what they replaced. In trying to start my car I used a 90 DIS module and it wiped out the dash cluster as you discribe yours. This is because the 89 and 90 DIS modules are different on the tach line and dis in lines. It will cause problems in the cluster.

Tyler

Hmmm, would an 89 DIS whipe out an L98 Dash? I hope it's not a DIS. normal ZR-1 DIS are costly, 89s who knows.

Eric

[phrogs]

Update:

Put the Tech 1 on it this afternoon and guess what.....

Code 46!!! Vats problem

Here is my question. Where is the VATs code stored? in the ECM? If so this has a refurbished ECM. So...


On the 90s the code is stored in the BCM body control module, but im not sure what the 89 would have used for these functions since it is the older dash.

But Like Tyler said I would program the ECM to by pass vats

[-=Jeff=-]

Hmmm, would an 89 DIS whipe out an L98 Dash? I hope it's not a DIS. normal ZR-1 DIS are costly, 89s who knows.

Eric

probably as the more I thnk about it the 6K and 8K dashes are probably pinned the same

Tyler, I assume a pin swap on the harness will allow a 90 DIS to work?

[1989ZR1#74]

well, I think the PASS Key Decoder Module is bad. I will try to replace it. Ironically enough all 3 of my 89s have VATS key #4. I can try the L98s Pass module.

[Tyler Townsley]

probably as the more I thnk about it the 6K and 8K dashes are probably pinned the same

Tyler, I assume a pin swap on the harness will allow a 90 DIS to work?

A 90 dis can run an 88-89 after the pin swap, that how mine is done. There is another gotcha on the 89s and not the 90s and thats the oil kill switch. If you look at the 89 wiring diagram there is a line that prevents fuel pressure until it sees oil pressure. I looked for that damn thing under ther dash for years until it dawned on me that it was looking for input from the oil pressure sender on the motor, as I remember it controls the fuel pumps. On the 90s+ the ecm controls this function. Its there to preent the pumps running in a accident.

These may help.
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/89_p_506.jpg
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/89_p_507.jpg
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/89_p_508.jpg
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/89_p_509.jpg
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/89_p_510.jpg
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/89_p_511.jpg
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/89_p_513.jpg
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/90_ign_mod.jpg

Thanks to George whever he is.

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Good stuff Tyler Good stuff. Can't wait to get back to it tomorrow.

Eric

[Corvettes White]

A 90 dis can run an 88-89 after the pin swap,...

Thanks to George whever he is.

Tyler

Hi Tyler. I am still around. Been following the threads. And am enjoying following along. With work soooo bad can't go much of anywere. My wife had said, "Go to the auction." The first one where the DR-1 sold (PS it is an '89 and not a '90 as posted elsewhere.) I told her, "If I could not pay to play." I would stay home. What is great is that a few of these cars have not gone to the crusher and that someone is enjoying and shairing what they are doing with them. Best regards and as a man once said, "Its not the car, its the people." George :wave:

[1989ZR1#74]

George is right

Here is the DR-1s SPI.

Note the K in the 10th digit, it is also a 51 not a 58. Per Tyler's serial sheet 100024 to 28 were "1989 Pilots, LT5 engine without ZR-1"

Note: WD1 = Pilot, and the FE1 suspension.

http://www.syreal.com/dr1spism.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

Well pulled the FX-3 Codes today. I got them all!

SRS Codes
13 Left Rear time out
14 Right Front time out
21 Left Front time out
22 Right Rear time out
23 Loss of vehicle speed signal
31 Left Front out of position
32 Right Front out of position
33 Left Rear out of position
34 Right Rear out of position
41 Selective Ride Control Switch short to Voltage
42 Selective Ride Control Switch open contacts
43 Selective Ride Control Switch open circuit

[1989ZR1#74]

Was able to pull part of the tank sticker today. To get the other part, I will have to find the mouse that ate it first...

http://www.syreal.com/tankstickercropsmall.jpg

A few thoughts:
Car was built after #010.
Was ordered by Advertising
Delivered to Campbell-Ewald Chevys ad agency.

[Nick]

Eric: Fascinating thread! Thanks so much for sharing and taking the time to post all of this. Best of luck! :cheers:

[1989ZR1#74]

Nick, its real easy cause its real fun!

OK this could be it:

http://www.syreal.com/53217954_pr.jpg

One thing that stands out is all of the wheel wells are blacked out. The shocks the A arms, the exhaust etc. All has a coat of flat black paint. At first I thought Sheridan did it, but why would they? Now I think it was to hide all the shiny bits from the camera. like in the above photo. I have an email off to R. Kramer. He is going to contact Jerry Burton at Campbell-Ewald to see if they have a file on it. Stay tuned...

[1989ZR1#74]

I keep raving about this paint job... When this car was painted (years ago before someone beat the S___ out of it) it was very nice. It has Black pin stripes that are so subtle I had to really work to get a good picture of them. Here is a shot of them rounding the Power Hump!

http://www.syreal.com/pinstripes.JPG

Just look how blue it is when lit from the side like it is.

[Corvettes White]

George is right

Here is the DR-1s SPI.

Note the K in the 10th digit, it is also a 51 not a 58. Per Tyler's serial sheet 100024 to 28 were "1989 Pilots, LT5 engine without ZR-1"

Note: WD1 = Pilot, and the FE1 suspension.

http://www.syreal.com/dr1spism.jpg

Okay, interesting, the vin is for a non ZR-1 car but the car HAS a wide body. Who bought the car by the way?

George

[Hammer]

Awesome thread. really appreciate you taking the time to share this with everyone. I can't wait to see this car in BG this. It will add to the specialness (that a word) of the event for sure.

[1989ZR1#74]

Okay, interesting, the vin is for a non ZR-1 car but the car HAS a wide body. Who bought the car by the way?

George

George,
I don't know. I was at the auction last year when it sold but Have no idea who the winning bidder was. I reread some of my emails/notes from #074 research. ZR-32 was #55. Heard you may have picked up some of the #55 bits from Cal Street Rods.

On another topic:

Some encoraging news, heard back from R.Kramer:

"That means there could be a trove of raw photography someplace at C-E. "

Oh boy I hope so. As ususal stay tuned...

[GOLDCYLON]

Well pulled the FX-3 Codes today. I got them all!

SRS Codes
13 Left Rear time out
14 Right Front time out
21 Left Front time out
22 Right Rear time out
23 Loss of vehicle speed signal
31 Left Front out of position
32 Right Front out of position
33 Left Rear out of position
34 Right Rear out of position
41 Selective Ride Control Switch short to Voltage
42 Selective Ride Control Switch open contacts
43Selective Ride Control Switch open circuit

Have you pulled the actuators yet? Just to verify they turn?

Also I would suggest bypassing the vats since you now know you have another code "4" key. You can buy the plug in harness with the correct valve at most parts houses.

Adaptive performance out in Surprise makes these adapters as well

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Vats-Bypass-Module-for-1986-1996-Corvette-GM-Cars-new_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem1c0f0583a3QQitemZ12 0511103907QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAcce ssories


CODE
RESISTOR VALUE IN OHMS FOR EACH OF THE 15 Keys

1
402

2
523

3
681

4
887

5
1130

6
1470

7
1870

8
2370

9
3010

10
3740

11
4750

12
6040

13
7500

14
9530

15
11800

[1989ZR1#74]

Have you pulled the actuators yet? Just to verify they turn?

No I have not. It's missing the driver front. The pass front is there and I have not checked if the rears are even there yet.

I am suffering from ZR-1-ADD. I am all over the place.

[GOLDCYLON]

No I have not. It's missing the driver front. The pass front is there and I have not checked if the rears are even there yet.

I am suffering from ZR-1-ADD. I am all over the place.


Do you know the testing procedure for the actuators?

[1989ZR1#74]

Do you know the testing procedure for the actuators?

Unless it involved gauze and 30 weight ball bearings I guess I don't. Have the shop manual though. Was planning on cracking that when I get to that portion of the "Barrett Jackson Experience"...

I read to pull them off to inspect the plastic gears. then cycle the ignition to see if the gears cycle during the initialization phase, repeat for all four locations.

Any additional pointers? Eric

[Tyler Townsley]

Unless it involved gauze and 30 weight ball bearings I guess I don't. Have the shop manual though. Was planning on cracking that when I get to that portion of the "Barrett Jackson Experience"...

I read to pull them off to inspect the plastic gears. then cycle the ignition to see if the gears cycle during the initialization phase, repeat for all four locations.

Any additional pointers? Eric

The rods seize due to lack of grease/oil. Make sure they turn freely. If the star gears are stripped some have had luck with star washers piled one on top of another and glued with silicone.

Tyler

[Tyler Townsley]

When you need help starting it just send me a plane ticket.LOL

Tyler

[GOLDCYLON]

Unless it involved gauze and 30 weight ball bearings I guess I don't. Have the shop manual though. Was planning on cracking that when I get to that portion of the "Barrett Jackson Experience"...

I read to pull them off to inspect the plastic gears. then cycle the ignition to see if the gears cycle during the initialization phase, repeat for all four locations.

Any additional pointers? Eric


Pretty close here is the best link Ive seen for the testing procedure. http://captainzcnc.com/ This guy rebuilds them.

Look for cracks on the metal stop gears, Seperation of the nylon gear and as Tlyer has pointed out making sure the top of the shock do turn.

[1989ZR1#74]

The rods seize due to lack of grease/oil. Make sure they turn freely. If the star gears are stripped some have had luck with star washers piled one on top of another and glued with silicone.

Tyler

Well, I am about 42 days from fixing the actuators, but I searched around and found this guy:

http://captainzcnc.com/_wsn/page4.html

Anyone use him to replace the plastic with aluminium gears? Woops Cy was answering when I was typing.

I would have picked you up in my plane, but I had to sell it to buy the car. ;)

Eric

[Jeffvette]

Well pulled the FX-3 Codes today. I got them all!

SRS Codes
13 Left Rear time out
14 Right Front time out
21 Left Front time out
22 Right Rear time out
23 Loss of vehicle speed signal
31 Left Front out of position
32 Right Front out of position
33 Left Rear out of position
34 Right Rear out of position
41 Selective Ride Control Switch short to Voltage
42 Selective Ride Control Switch open contacts
43Selective Ride Control Switch open circuit

So basically you have every FX3 code. First clear the codes on the controller and see what comes back. Then start tackling it from there. If you can't clear the codes, start looking for a controller.

[1989ZR1#74]

Today's update:

Put her up on jack stands and pulled the rear tires.

Wow check out the tires.

http://www.syreal.com/reartires.jpg

They look unused.

[1989ZR1#74]

More paint details:

These are reverse pin stripes. Black base coat is taped then the metallic coats applied.

http://www.syreal.com/pinstrip2.JPG

http://www.syreal.com/pinstrip3.JPG

[Z51JEFF]

George,
I reread some of my emails/notes from #074 research. ZR-32 was #55. Heard you may have picked up some of the #55 bits from Cal Street Rods.


California Street Rods,wasnt that the shop run by Chuck Lombardo?I think that was the guys lsat name.

[1989ZR1#74]

California Street Rods,wasnt that the shop run by Chuck Lombardo?I think that was the guys lsat name.

Chuck Lombardo Sr and Jr. They did a lot of hot rods for GM. They cut up #55 to build the ZR-32. They had #003 at their shop and showed it at SEMA. They had #74 and painted it purple. They had a couple of Actives as well.

[ZZZZZR1]

Today's update:

Put her up on jack stands and pulled the rear tires.

Wow check out the tires.

http://www.syreal.com/reartires.jpg

They look unused.


Stock tires from 1988? Priceless!!!!!!!

[1989ZR1#74]

Stock tires from 1988? Priceless!!!!!!!
Man I messed up that picture. I used 2x the driver side. no worry they both look the same.

UPDATE:

Crawled under the 6 speed. Will get a picture up tomorrow

Its gearbox no. 000354.

Eric

[Corvettes White]

California Street Rods,wasnt that the shop run by Chuck Lombardo?I think that was the guys lsat name.

I ended up with some old hoses from the car but after they had been first sold to a third party. I had totally forgot about those until you reminded me.

George

[Tyler Townsley]

I ended up with some old hoses from the car but after they had been first sold to a third party. I had totally forgot about those until you reminded me.

George

Is that the shop you got the active suspension shots from?

Tyler

[Corvettes White]

Is that the shop you got the active suspension shots from?

Tyler ;)

[BlackWidow#2]

Hi Eric, What color was 074 originally? This thread is great. Keep it going.
Thanks, George C.

[1989ZR1#74]

Hi Eric, What color was 074 originally? This thread is great. Keep it going.
Thanks, George C.


George, #074 was bright red 81U. It was in Randy Leffingwell's Corvette - Fifty Years. The official 50th annaversary book. Pages 306 & 307 if you have it

http://www.syreal.com/board3.jpg


This is the actual #74 in a picture taken by Randy Leffingwell for the May 26th 1989 Los Angeles Times review of the car.

[1989ZR1#74]

Morning Update:

Spent some time on the front air dam. It is pretty messed up. I took it off yesterday. I heated and straightend it. Turns out its missing the center air deflector. Will have to source one of those. While I was crawling around I found a few tiny bits of overspray from a previous red paint job. Looks like this ZR-1 was 81U Bright red at one point. Not sure when or why it was but it was.

Last night I crawled up under the transmission and took this:

http://www.syreal.com/trannytag2.JPG

I also confirmed 12volts to the ECM.

[1989ZR1#74]

Well I just heard from Edgard Solis the Automotive departement Head at Sheridan Tech Center...

"Yes, this Auto body collision and refinishing school painted it."

So much for my GM Styling exercise. Well now a Dark Red Metallic paint job is in order.

[1989ZR1#74]

;)


Hey what transmission number was connected to #010s LT5?

[BlackWidow#2]

George, #81 was bright red 81U. It was in Randy Leffingwell's Corvette - Fifty Years. The official 50th annaversary book. Pages 306 & 307 if you have it

http://www.syreal.com/board3.jpg


This is the actual #74 in a picture taken by Randy Leffingwell for the May 26th 1989 Los Angeles Times review of the car.

Hi Eric, Yes I have the book. It looks like the camera didn't move between the 2 pictures! Which car is on the next page?
Thanks for all your updates, you have my attention.

[1989ZR1#74]

Hi Eric, Yes I have the book. It looks like the camera didn't move between the 2 pictures! Which car is on the next page?
Thanks for all your updates, you have my attention.

Page 308, 309, & 310 are all #74. In fact the picture on 309 is what I used to identify it. If you look on the steering wheel right above the "1/2" on the fuel gauge you will see a nick. That nick was caused by the LA Times writer Paul Dean's signet ring. Paul was driving and he nicked the wheel. Randy had to take pictures of the inside of the car and there was this cut. They used a marker to color it in. Well the nick is still in the wheel.

[1989ZR1#74]

Well I spent the afternoon removing flat black paint from the Drivers front wheel well. Now that I know the school did that it has to go. I also checked the transmission VIN number and 0004 is there!. The engine though has no VIN. It only has MM 0418 on the oil pan boss. The Rear passenger side is bare.

http://www.syreal.com/P1trannystamp.JPG

http://www.syreal.com/drivwheel.JPG

[Corvettes White]

...The engine though has no VIN. It only has MM 0418 on the oil pan boss. The Rear passenger side is bare.


Check both sides of the motor, From what I undersatnd the side of the motor the VIN was marked on is inconsistant. George

[Tyler Townsley]

Well I just heard from Edgard Solis the Automotive departement Head at Sheridan Tech Center...

"Yes, this Auto body collision and refinishing school painted it."

So much for my GM Styling exercise. Well now a Dark Red Metallic paint job is in order.



I thought I said that some time ago. They told me that when I looked at it some years ago. There may be some other ZR-1 like this still out there. HMMMM

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Corvettes White (George) sent me this picture of #55 before the conversion to ZR-32... Good stuff.

http://www.syreal.com/89%20no%2055.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

The 89s showed "Full Engine Power" when the key is on. Here is #74s moments ago...

http://www.syreal.com/fullpower1.JPG

[1989ZR1#74]

I thought I said that some time ago. They told me that when I looked at it some years ago. There may be some other ZR-1 like this still out there. HMMMM

Tyler


Yeah I know you said that and I believed you, but I needed a question to ask Edgard to break the ice. I was trying desperately to not have to repaint this car. Well he wants me to call him on Tuesday for more details...

[-=Jeff=-]

Corvettes White (George) sent me this picture of #55 before the conversion to ZR-32... Good stuff.

http://www.syreal.com/89%20no%2055.jpg

COOL!!! I even see the ZZ TOP Eliminator in the background

[1989ZR1#74]

COOL!!! I even see the ZZ TOP Eliminator in the background

That may be the Clone. Califonia Street Rods built a clone of the Eliminator so they could bring it on tour with them.

[Tyler Townsley]

Yeah I know you said that and I believed you, but I needed a question to ask Edgard to break the ice. I was trying desperately to not have to repaint this car. Well he wants me to call him on Tuesday for more details...

I figured as much. One thing to remember about cars like this is if you know the story you can pick a place in time and restore/leave the car as it appeared on that date. The stint at the tech school and the paint job are part of the story and I would not repaint it. Would you want to repaint the #74 car? Its the same thing.

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Yes, I thought of that, but #074 was painted by California Street Rods and appeared in magazines. And is the sister to ZR-32. Thats a little different.

http://www.syreal.com/deucevette.jpg

[BlackWidow#2]

Page 308, 309, & 310 are all #74. In fact the picture on 309 is what I used to identify it. If you look on the steering wheel right above the "1/2" on the fuel gauge you will see a nick. That nick was caused by the LA Times writer Paul Dean's signet ring. Paul was driving and he nicked the wheel. Randy had to take pictures of the inside of the car and there was this cut. They used a marker to color it in. Well the nick is still in the wheel.

Sorry to keep asking about 074, but I see it had 722 miles on it when the picture was taken. Roughly how many when you bought it?
That knick is very small, you did a great job on that (finding it, etc.)

I know what Tyler is saying about the paint, but I'd go with the dark red too, although the school job would be lost forever. Regardless it's a great car to own! George

[1989ZR1#74]

Sorry to keep asking about 074, but I see it had 722 miles on it when the picture was taken. Roughly how many when you bought it?
That knick is very small, you did a great job on that (finding it, etc.)

I know what Tyler is saying about the paint, but I'd go with the dark red too, although the school job would be lost forever. Regardless it's a great car to own! George

It now has 21Km. Hib Halverson drove #74 in August of 1989 ("Real Life with The King" great article) and it had 5,096 miles on it. He wrote about it in a 1990 Issue of Vette. It went to Cal Street Rods shortly after 8/89 so CHuck Lombardo jr must have put 15Kmi on it.

I studied those pictures for a long time. Most of the 1989 ZR-1s covered in liturature where the June 1988 Riverside pilots (1 Red/Red, 1 Yellow/Red) or the Europe cars. There seems to be 2 post France USA magazine cars. 1 Red/Red that was featured in ZR-1 vs Porsche, ZR-1 VS Ferrari etc. There seems to be only 1 post France Red/Black press car, #74. SO when I saw Red/black in the 50th book I wrote the author. He told me about the LA TImes article and off I went.

[BlackWidow#2]

It sounds like Chuck Jr was a lucky guy at the time! Have you been in contact with him? You'd think GM would have told him not to drive it.

Did all 15 of the cars sent to France return after the event?

Thanks, George

[Tyler Townsley]

Every car has a story and yes the 4th of the 89s is interesting so is the stint with the school and susquent paint job > Think the paint was for one of the Miami International car show events in the 90s.

Tyler

[Z51JEFF]

Years ago there was some nice stuff coming out of CSR down in L.A.

[1989ZR1#74]

It sounds like Chuck Jr was a lucky guy at the time! Have you been in contact with him? You'd think GM would have told him not to drive it.

Did all 15 of the cars sent to France return after the event?

Thanks, George

According to Heart of The Beast:

"At the end of four weeks of relentless pounding, the ZR-1s, none worse for the wear, were shipped back to Detroit"

If I had to guess these Europe cars That were built the last week of January, First Week of February 1989 fell within the #033 to #60 range. Based on my tracking I don't have any complete survivors in that range. They were the first ZR-1s to be fitted with the Phase IV engines. I assume they were all used for further durability testing.

Here is what I have accounted for:

Survivors:
003, 004, 016, 074, 078

Modified but mostly intact:
040 Conan V12, 045 NCM record car, 081 (Snake Skinner), 0?? Snake Skinner II

Crushed Recovered:
014, 080

Engines/parts:
010,028,055, 075

[1989ZR1#74]

Every car has a story and yes the 4th of the 89s is interesting so is the stint with the school and susquent paint job > Think the paint was for one of the Miami International car show events in the 90s.

Tyler

I like the paint and more then likely will repair and touch it up for now. I am looking for any pictures of the car at the Miami shows. That's another question I ask the School. It was also Bright Red at some point too.

[A26B]

I used to have the following engines. Is it possible that any of these were 89 pilot numbers?

1K5800026
1K5800029
1K5800045
1K5800062

[1989ZR1#74]

I used to have the following engines. Is it possible that any of these were 89 pilot numbers?

1K5800026
1K5800029
1K5800045
1K5800062

K = 1989 so I would think those were 89s.

026 and 029 would have been active prototypes. Did they have Active stuff on them?

045 and 062 would have been "Engineering Units" Or production 89s that were not sold.

I have only somewhat confirmed 45 as the Record car, but they did use a new off the shelf engine so #045s orignial had to go somewhere.

[A26B]

Yes, 026 & 029 had remnants of active system
045 was the one that perked my interest after reading your post with 045 in the list. I sold it a couple of years ago and still know where it probably is, if the need should arise. I do have a few photos of the engine.

[1989ZR1#74]

Yes, 026 & 029 had remnants of active system
045 was the one that perked my interest after reading your post with 045 in the list. I sold it a couple of years ago and still know where it probably is, if the need should arise. I do have a few photos of the engine.

THe record car at the museum no longer has a vin it has a EX plate so I can't confirm that it is 045 or not and there is a record clone out there. Is the museum car the clone or the real one? I don't know. Hopefully someday it can be confirmed. (I would not break the bank buying back #045 on my circumstantial evidence based on P numbers)

The V12 confimed VIN is #040 it has a P number of P9Y074
The NCM record car has a P number of P9Y079. I guess all I know for sure is NCM was 5 Y engineering cars later. FWIW

[phrogs]

THe record car at the museum no longer has a vin it has a EX plate so I can't confirm that it is 045 or not and there is a record clone out there. Is the museum car the clone or the real one? I don't know. Hopefully someday it can be confirmed. (I would not break the bank buying back #045 on my circumstantial evidence based on P numbers)

The V12 confimed VIN is #040 it has a P number of P9Y074
The NCM record car has a P number of P9Y079. I guess all I know for sure is NCM was 5 Y engineering cars later. FWIW


If the museum would remove the forward Left hand fender well the rear half they could look for the vin stamp on the frame rail I cant imagine they wouldnt stamp these cars like any other.

[Hammer]

If the museum would remove the forward Left hand fender well the rear half they could look for the vin stamp on the frame rail I cant imagine they wouldnt stamp these cars like any other.

Sounds like a 20th Anniversary Bash project to me!!!

[1989ZR1#74]

If the museum would remove the forward Left hand fender well the rear half they could look for the vin stamp on the frame rail I cant imagine they wouldnt stamp these cars like any other.

I doubt they would do that. I know the 89's have their vin stamped there as 004 and 074 do. The car still belongs to GM they would have to do it. I can't even get them to let me step over the rope to get a close look. Oh well. I was thinking of ordering the Build sheet for #45. Tyler's Queenie has its P8Y087 and EX5014 printed on the build sheet. Theres a good chance 45 will have one too.

[gbrtng]

THe record car at the museum no longer has a vin it has a EX plate so I can't confirm that it is 045 or not and there is a record clone out there. Is the museum car the clone or the real one?
I don't know but have heard there is one at the Smithsonian in DC. Morrison should know.

[LGAFF]

I believe Skankeskinner II Was a 1991.

[1989ZR1#74]

I beleive Skankeskinner II Was a 1991.
I spent a lot of time around II at BJ last year. It is an 89 or 88 prototype. Flat Dash and 89/88 interior. Had an EX# the center console had the SPI but the roll bar was in the way. It would only open 2 inches.

[LGAFF]

I guess it is:

http://www.barrett-jackson.com/application/onlinesubmission/currentcarlist.aspx?aid=283&sd=01/17/2009&ed=01/17/2009

[LGAFF]

I guess it is:

http://www.barrett-jackson.com/application/onlinesubmission/currentcarlist.aspx?aid=283&sd=01/17/2009&ed=01/17/2009

I just recalled the matched moldings

[1989ZR1#74]

Just looked at my old pictures. SSII had a black expansion tank. #55 is the oldest white tank I have seen. It was originally medium blue metallic with black interior and is a widebody.

It was/is EX6153

it has the same 8331 ECM that #04 and #074 have

[ZZZZZR1]

Would anyone be interested in a special discussion about these prototypes @ BG this year? Maybe a 2hr open discussion?

Maybe if we could get a car like #4 on display and a few "resident experts" to discuss it? I bet Gordon and a few others will contribute too.


If so, I'll add it on our Agenda.

:happy1:


David

[1989ZR1#74]

Would anyone be interested in a special discussion about these prototypes @ BG this year? Maybe a 2hr open discussion?

Maybe if we could get a car like #4 on display and a few "resident experts" to discuss it? I bet Gordon and a few others will contribute too.


If so, I'll add it on our Agenda.

:happy1:


David

Sounds great, There would be 4 of us in the room! What I would like to know is how they allocated them? How did John H. Get to modify the Snake Skinner? How did the V12 project get green lighted. Years later Chevrolet spent a lot of time tracking them back down. They really did not want them in private hands. Guys like Dick Balsley and Art Armstrong went on a hunt to make sure they were all accounted for. Art told me he had the VIN plates from all the destroyed 89s on a wire like a set of keys.

In my traded Emails with Dick he is clearly PO'd at GM selling them off after all the work that went into finding them and returning them to the Heritage Center.

[1989ZR1#74]

Well Corvettes White George you were right. The VIN stamp is on the Drivers side of the block. It was tough to see without some probe camera technology. But there it was 00004.. So the engine is the one it left Bowling Green with. Also reinstalled the front hood Cross Flags. Tested about 5 touch up paints to see if I can get close to original color. No luck yet.

[DMark]

Would anyone be interested in a special discussion about these prototypes @ BG this year?
That would be SO COOL!!!!!!! :cool:

[Z51JEFF]

Ive been in contact with John Heinricy on Facebook about this Prototype thread.I asked John if he would mind stopping by to share his insight on the 87-89 cars,he stated he couldnt find this website.I dont want to bug the guy again about this,Im sure if somebody asked he would would share the info.If anybody from the inside has info on these cars it would have to be John Heinricy.

[1989ZR1#74]

I took #074 out tonight. Met PhillipsLT5 and Loren at the Pavilions. Great guys. I tell you what those 21 year old gatorbacks just won't hook up!

[1989ZR1#74]

"he stated he couldnt find this website" Can we send him the link?

[1989ZR1#74]

Endoscope!
http://www.syreal.com/scope.jpg

[Z51JEFF]

"he stated he couldnt find this website" Can we send him the link?

I think I tried but I most likely screwed it up and he didnt get it.He may have gone to the main site,ZR1.NET and gottin lost there.

[1989ZR1#74]

I think I tried but I most likely screwed it up and he didnt get it.He may have gone to the main site,ZR1.NET and gottin lost there.


http://www.zr1netregistry.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11000


Cut and paste this.

Eric

[Tyler Townsley]

I spent a lot of time around II at BJ last year. It is an 89 or 88 prototype. Flat Dash and 89/88 interior. Had an EX# the center console had the SPI but the roll bar was in the way. It would only open 2 inches.

I think the 89s had the tinted windshield, the 88s do not. It was the 88s showed they were too hot for the A/C system.

Yes they all have a vin on the frame. The 88s windshield vin start with EX5002 and end with EX5026 the frame vins are J5100034 to 00055. Interestingly the EX vins do not sequentully follow the frame vins. ie the car before mine has an EX5010 number. Two names we need at the May event Gib Huffstlder and ?? Eckles. Tom Hill said Eckles probably has the best memory on these days and cars.

***
Guys like Dick Balsley and Art Armstrong went on a hunt to make sure they were all accounted for. Art told me he had the VIN plates from all the destroyed 89s on a wire like a set of keys.

****

Funniest thing about the vin tags, he may have the MFG vin tags but what about the EX vin tags. I am pretty sure some of the Challange cars had EX vins. There was a yellow Challange car for sale some years ago that had an EX vin.

Good thing they did not know about the 88s. When I talked to Dick about the #4 car he had no idea GM had made 88 prototypes, I think he did not believe me, but he sure wanted the # 4 car.


Tyker

[1989ZR1#74]

1989 Corvette Challenge "Splash" info sold at BJ 2009:

http://www.syreal.com/splash1.jpg

http://www.syreal.com/splashvin.JPG

[1989ZR1#74]

I think the 89s had the tinted windshield, the 88s do not. It was the 88s showed they were too hot for the A/C system.


Both 004 and 074 have non solar ray windscreens:

004 Date Code is X I or 2/1988

http://www.syreal.com/windshielddate.JPG


#074 windshield is dated V I or 12/1988

http://www.syreal.com/lofwindshield.jpg

[Tyler Townsley]

I will check the date code on the protype solar windshield tommorrow. The yellow car I saw had a EX vin, not sure how it was in private hands. I believe it was on ebay but it was some years ago.

Tyler

[Tyler Townsley]

This is the vin on a 89 at the St Pete GP in 89.

http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype/EX%20vin%20tag.jpg

Bill Herron took the picture after noticing the EX#. This car was used to prerun the track. Probably testing it. Its 800+ numbers after mine.

Tyler

[-=Jeff=-]

I don't know but have heard there is one at the Smithsonian in DC. Morrison should know.


There is.. I have seen it and somewhere I have a Pic of it, but not close enoguh to get a VIN off of it though

[1989ZR1#74]

There is.. I have seen it and somewhere I have a Pic of it, but not close enoguh to get a VIN off of it though


http://americanhistory.si.edu/about/staff.cfm?key=12&staffkey=306&type=board

Mr. Morrison’s current partnership, with banker and racing-car developer Warren Mosler has resulted in the MT900. In 2000, NMAH appointed him to its Development Advisory Committee for America on the Move. In 1997, Mr. Morrison responded to the Smithsonian's request and donated one of his ZR-l racing Corvettes. The car thus became the first sports car collected by the Smithsonian. Mr. Morrison's engine development work led to the improvement of synthetic oils marketed by Mobil and also led to the development of GM's "Northstar" engine, used in today's Cadillacs. In the mid-1980s, he brought General Motors and Mobil together to create the Mobil I Corvette Racing Team. For 10 years, Morrison's Mobil I Corvettes and Camaros dominated endurance racing in the United States for production-based cars. For the Albany Realty Co., Mr. Morrison innovated the use of U.S. Geological Survey data on specific conditions of soil and water to match buyers with land best suited for timber or various crops. One sale - for 13,000 acres to Container Corporation of America - provided capital to begin his own commercial real estate firm, and also led to a relationship with Mobil Corporation, which owned CCA. Mr. Morrison resides in Albany, GA.

http://books.google.com/books?id=1CqX-40TnVUC&pg=PA324&lpg=PA324&dq=tommy+morrison+zr-1+simthsonian&source=bl&ots=IjoiPSK8On&sig=it7uvQUdqIBdViTVD9XkOB9SVxI&hl=en&ei=XwhlS7HbB4XIsQOT_cG5DQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9&ved=0CB8Q6AEwCA#v=onepage&q=&f=false

[1989ZR1#74]

This is the vin on a 89 at the St Pete GP in 89.

http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype/EX%20vin%20tag.jpg

Bill Herron took the picture after noticing the EX#. This car was used to prerun the track. Probably testing it. Its 800+ numbers after mine.

Tyler


EX# for Snake Skinner II

http://www.syreal.com/ssiivin.jpg

Tyler's 89 St Pete GP EX:

http://www.syreal.com/stpgp89vin.jpg

1990 Active Sold at BJ Scottsdale 2009 and Palm Beach 2009:

http://www.syreal.com/90activevin.JPG

1990 ZR-1 EX number 6274

http://www.syreal.com/90ex6274.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

Must be a default if I dont have an LT5 or ZR-1

John, Great to have you stop by. I believe that the L98 is there until you hit a certain number of posts.

1st question I have for you... #004 has a 6k RPM dash and the Full power light is missing. #74 has the 8K RPM dash and the full power light. Is it possible that the pilot left BG with the L98 dash?

http://www.syreal.com/fullpowerdif.jpg
#004 does have the full power key:
http://www.syreal.com/Fullpowersmall.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

I just stole this picture from somebody,hope they dont mind.This was at the auction.Whats the story with that purple car in the background.:-Dhttp://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a136/FLYTYM/P1010461.jpg


That is most definatley Purple Smash:

http://www.syreal.com/100_0190.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

It had the 8k tach at the school when I saw it. My 88 prototype has 8k unit so it would not make sense that #4 did not as the dash in mine is a april 87 unit.

EX vin of active suspension car Geogre saw in Calif some years ago.
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/active2.jpg
I think the vin I posted above is for another active suspension car at the same place. I will have to hunt down the St Pete picture.

Eric my protype lof windshield is M 44 ??

Tyler


Tyler does yours have the full power light?

[Tyler Townsley]

OK the previous post is an active suspension car, one of 2 George saw in Calif. I have a picture of the St Pete car somewhere. This is the second vin.
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/active2.jpg

So you have 3 active suspension vins.

Eric my prototype windscreen has a M 44 date?
My Full power wireing is/was never connected.

We must have been posting while they were moving the site as my msg is gone but you have it quoted??

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Here are John's "LOST" responses:

"If the car will run and drive with the L98 dash, then I suppose it is possible. What would be the reason? Maybe the correct dash was late to pilot and the customer, Chevrolet advertising, who was notorious for trying to get it's cars sooner because of the lead time for the shots, etc and developing the brochures. One reason why this does not seem reasonable is that these cars would usually be used for both inside and outside photos. There could have been an agreement to supply the parts later and this way they could get their work started. Since these cars were never planned for sale it was not unusual for them to have some wrong parts. They would not have been a "PEP" car as an example because theyu would not have been saleable cars. The first saleable pilot Corvette was the 1996. "


"Did the Snakeskinner II have a cage? I think so. It was a protoype car that had outlived it's usefullness as a test car, so it would have been scrapped. Our traffic safety folks needed training cars and they were always after us to transfer Corvette to them so they could make training cars out of them. I'm pretty sure I had this request from them and approved the transfer. They liked my "real" Snakeskinner and decided to use the name on it. "



In response to Tyler's Phase II question:

"There should be but I dont know who would have it. I know one guy and i'll ask him. "

[1989ZR1#74]

Did the Snakeskinner II have a cage? I think so. It was a protoype car that had outlived it's usefullness as a test car, so it would have been scrapped. Our traffic safety folks needed training cars and they were always after us to transfer Corvette to them so they could make training cars out of them. I'm pretty sure I had this request from them and approved the transfer. They liked my "real" Snakeskinner and decided to use the name on it.


Yes it did, and side pipes. Was once teal/green now white:

http://www.syreal.com/snakeii1.jpg

http://www.syreal.com/ssii2.jpg

http://www.syreal.com/ssii3.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

If the car will run and drive with the L98 dash, then I suppose it is possible. What would be the reason? Maybe the correct dash was late to pilot and the customer, Chevrolet advertising, who was notorious for trying to get it's cars sooner because of the lead time for the shots, etc and developing the brochures. One reason why this does not seem reasonable is that these cars would usually be used for both inside and outside photos. There could have been an agreement to supply the parts later and this way they could get their work started. Since these cars were never planned for sale it was not unusual for them to have some wrong parts. They would not have been a "PEP" car as an example because theyu would not have been saleable cars. The first saleable pilot Corvette was the 1996.

I suppose the production delays on the project made it apparent that a 1989 ZR-1 Brochure/marketing material would not be made. So long before the April 1989 push to a 90 MY, the sales material would have been canceled, making the retofit of the correct ZR-1 option items Irrelevant . (Non power sport seats, non powered seats, standard radio, l98 dash).
On #74 the Sport Seats are dated about a week after the build sheet states it was made. I suppose some of those specialty parts may have been delayed.
The fact that #010 was built on 3/22/88 and #004 did not start until 4/19/88 show that those pilot cars had a lot of irregularities. The engine is stamped MM 0418. Was this the build date? April 18th? if so that engine had to high tail it over to BG to get installed.

Do you know what serial range would have been sent to Europe? The misconception has been since #016 went that the other 15 would have been 1 through 15, but that can't be. They would have had to have Phase IV LT-5s.
Alllied Vauhn states the car was a PEP car. Not sure why or how they arrived at that, but that's what they say is in the database.

[1989ZR1#74]

After the cancelation and move to the 1990 MY there must have been 50 89 ZR-1s lying around. Has there ever been that many unsaleable "project" cars to play with? It seems like so many "fun" EX cars came out of that group. In the long run did having those "Engineer Units" available make the ZR-1 project better? Eric

[1989ZR1#74]

It's funny you should bring up the 1996 pilots. I went looking for the first LT4 awhile back, Thanks to carfax I found it:

http://www.syreal.com/1996first13.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

Not to get too CSI on you but I think the picture Tyler took back in 2006 shows 343.? something on the odo. What do you think?

I wish I could tell someone to "Enhance"..... "Enhance"..... "Enhance...." like they do in the movies.

http://www.syreal.com/004odo.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

OK the previous post is an active suspension car, one of 2 George saw in Calif. I have a picture of the St Pete car somewhere. This is the second vin.
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/active2.jpg

So you have 3 active suspension vins.

Eric my prototype windscreen has a M 44 date?
My Full power wireing is/was never connected.

We must have been posting while they were moving the site as my msg is gone but you have it quoted??

Tyler

I moved my posts with quotes over. Nothing from the old site after midnight made it...

M 44 is not the correct date fomat. The date code for the windshield should be right above that. It will be two letters. The month letter should be above the M44 code and the year to the right.

So what are our 3 actives?

EX5881 At Barrett Jackson Scottsdale/Palm Springs 2009
EX5883 At St. Pete
EX5884 At California Street Rods.

[Demps]

Once again...you guys are AWESOME. Thanks for sharing!

Heinrocket, it sent a chill up my spin with the credibility you offer to two already very knowlegdeable folks.

This thread should NEVER go away!

I'm glad the "early" ZR-1 bug never bit me... I already have a serious problem.

Ted

[Hammer]

I'm glad the "early" ZR-1 bug never bit me... I already have a serious problem.

Ted

Yep, you do. And I read where you want to add an Aqua car now. :-D

[1989ZR1#74]

Once again...you guys are AWESOME. Thanks for sharing!

Heinrocket, it sent a chill up my spin with the credibility you offer to two already very knowlegdeable folks.

This thread should NEVER go away!

I'm glad the "early" ZR-1 bug never bit me... I already have a serious problem.

Ted

Ted No kidding try negotiating for a 8000k 89 Star Wars dash with a guy that has the only one for sale... in the world. Talk about a position of power. Not a cheap habit.

[1989ZR1#74]

BTW I don't know how I missed this but subtract the following 7 from the 84 1989s:

K5800033 1990 Proto 1990
K5800034 1990 Proto 1990
K5800035 1990 Proto 1990
K5800036 1990 Proto 1990
K5800037 1990 Proto 1990
K5800038 1990 Proto 1990
K5800039 1990 Proto 1990


Now it appears there were only 77 1989 ZR-1s made. Then if you subtract the 15 actives..

K5800018 Active Prototype
K5800019 Active Prototype
K5800020 Active Prototype
K5800021 Active Prototype
K5800022 Active Prototype
K5800023 Active Prototype
K5800024 Active Prototype
K5800025 Active Prototype
K5800026 Active Prototype
K5800027 Active Prototype
K5800028 Active Prototype
K5800029 Active Prototype
K5800030 Active Prototype
K5800031 Active Prototype
K5800032 Active Prototype

It appears that there were only 62 1989 ZR-1s produced

I always wondered where the sign that came with 004 got its number:

http://www.syreal.com/sign60.jpg

[Tyler Townsley]

I moved my posts with quotes over. Nothing from the old site after midnight made it...

M 44 is not the correct date fomat. The date code for the windshield should be right above that. It will be two letters. The month letter should be above the M44 code and the year to the right.

So what are our 3 actives?

EX5881 At Barrett Jackson Scottsdale/Palm Springs 2009
EX5883 At St. Pete
EX5884 At California Street Rods.

http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype/EX%20vin%20tag.jpg

The 86 car was with the 84 car in Calif. I posted the wrong vin tag for the St Pete car, going to have to find that picture again. I do not think the St Pete car was an active sus car.

http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype/P-WIN2.JPG

Picture of the prototype glass.

Tyler

[Tyler Townsley]

Just to get this in the open. This is EX5023 (P8Y094) 1988 s/n48. I have posted the picture before but not the information.
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype/BlueWreckFront.jpg
Who is that young wippersnapper in the picture?
It is one of the graveyard cars and was Geoff Jeals engineering car 1989-1990. He has pictures of it before crushed with his boys. As part of his payment for helping Ed get the cars out he kept this one. In my mind this was the better choice. He was somewhat anoyed when mine surfaced but still found and built the motor foir me. The car is currently in Mich undergoing restoration. It was for sale at one point but Geoff changed his mind.

Tyler

[Corvettes White]

BTW I don't know how I missed this but subtract the following 7 from the 84 1989s:

K5800033 1990 Proto 1990
K5800034 1990 Proto 1990
K5800035 1990 Proto 1990
K5800036 1990 Proto 1990
K5800037 1990 Proto 1990
K5800038 1990 Proto 1990
K5800039 1990 Proto 1990


Now it appears there were only 77 1989 ZR-1s made. Then if you subtract the 15 actives..

K5800018 Active Prototype
K5800019 Active Prototype
K5800020 Active Prototype
K5800021 Active Prototype
K5800022 Active Prototype
K5800023 Active Prototype
K5800024 Active Prototype
K5800025 Active Prototype
K5800026 Active Prototype
K5800027 Active Prototype
K5800028 Active Prototype
K5800029 Active Prototype
K5800030 Active Prototype
K5800031 Active Prototype
K5800032 Active Prototype




To the list you need to add the LT-5 powered non-ZR-1 cars. The DR-1 is one of them and there is a white convertable in a photo in "The Heart of the Beast."

George

[Z51JEFF]

John H,thanks for making it over and thanks goes to 1989ZR1#74 for letting use inside his 1989 cars and Tyler for the inside info.All of this makes owning one of these cars just a little bit more magical.:thumbsup:

[bdw18_123]

John H,thanks for making it over and thanks goes to 1989ZR1#74 for letting use inside his 1989 cars and Tyler for the inside info. All of this makes owning one of these cars just a little bit more magical.:thumbsup:

I agree, I have been following this thread. It's been extremely interesting. I even have a folder on my computer filled with pictures & info of different ZR-1 & LT-5 prototypes that I started collecting after I bought my '90 ZR-1.

[Blue Flame Restorations]

Hi eric. I'm really happy that you ended up with the car. I would have loved to have purchased it. Congrats!!!!!!!! See you at BG in May!!!

Now, all you need to do is sell me the purple car.:mrgreen:.............seriously.

Brett Henderson
1990 Mobil1 #99
1989 Unconverted Challenge Car
53's & 54's

[Tyler Townsley]

I suppose the production delays on the project made it apparent that a 1989 ZR-1 Brochure/marketing material would not be made. So long before the April 1989 push to a 90 MY, the sales material would have been canceled, making the retofit of the correct ZR-1 option items Irrelevant .

Au Contrare Eric, I have an 1989 Advance Product Information book that has the LT-5 info in it. Here is the cover letter.
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype/89promo.jpg

Here are the picturs from 2006 when I found the car.

http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/ZR0401S.JPG
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/ZR0403S.JPG
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/ZR0404S.JPG
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/ZR0410S.JPG
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/ZR0414S.JPG
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/ZR0415S.JPG
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/ZR0416S.JPG
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/ZR0417S.JPG

Tyler

[Z51JEFF]

I just noticed the car has a 91 CORVETTE emblem on the rear bumper.

[zedrone]

Hi All,

Thanks for the invite Tyler.

All of the '86- newer cars would have come with an 8k tach from the factory.

To start the car, you will need to bypass the VATS module *and* reprogram the ECM to not look for the VATS signal. The module behind the breadbox activates the fuel pump and allows the starter to engage, the ECM won't pulse the injectors unless its getting the correct information from the car. We never figured out how this interface worked on the '86, so we went around it.

Ed

[zedrone]

Ted No kidding try negotiating for a 8000k 89 Star Wars dash with a guy that has the only one for sale... in the world. Talk about a position of power. Not a cheap habit.

Its all relative

*shrug*

Ed

[Corvettes White]

Its all relative

*shrug*

Ed

Been there. Done that. Good to see your name here. George out in Southern California.

[zedrone]

Been there. Done that. Good to see your name here. George out in Southern California.

Hi George,

Drop me a PM with how the project is going.

Ed

[1989ZR1#74]

thanks for the input. Been a bit under the weather the last day or so. I have no updates for today. Hopefully I can make some progress tomorrow. I do like the R Kramer memo, but for whatever reason this Z left Bowling green without Most of the ZR-1 interior options and it was never retrofitted so It could not have been used for interior shots.

[-=Jeff=-]

zedrone.. Nice to see you here. I have gotten stuff from you in the past. I still want to see the pictures of the yellow vert you did. That was cool when you had pictures of it on your website about 10 years ago..

[zedrone]

thanks for the input. Been a bit under the weather the last day or so. I have no updates for today. Hopefully I can make some progress tomorrow. I do like the R Kramer memo, but for whatever reason this Z left Bowling green without Most of the ZR-1 interior options and it was never retrofitted so It could not have been used for interior shots.

The cars that had real VIN numbers were, for all intents and purposes, production cars. Anything that is missing from the car was done in the hands of the tech schools or cannibals along the way. There are/ were a few more in the hands of technical schools and other obscure museums-race shops that you wouldn't normally think about.

Ed

[-=Jeff=-]

I don't know but have heard there is one at the Smithsonian in DC. Morrison should know.


There is.. I have seen it and somewhere I have a Pic of it, but not close enoguh to get a VIN off of it though


Smithsonian Morrison Car:
http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/corvette-photos/data/643/2DCP_0400.JPG

[Tyler Townsley]

The cars that had real VIN numbers were, for all intents and purposes, production cars. Anything that is missing from the car was done in the hands of the tech schools or cannibals along the way. There are/ were a few more in the hands of technical schools and other obscure museums-race shops that you wouldn't normally think about.

Ed

Eric post a copy of the build info. Have you gotten a copy of the build sheet from the NCM. There is also one in the frount suspension.
Ed how about coming to the reunion this year and bring your photos? Your graveyard stories would be a real hit. Miight even be able to coax Geoff to come too.

Tyler

[zedrone]

Eric post a copy of the build info. Have you gotten a copy of the build sheet from the NCM. There is also one in the frount suspension.
Ed how about coming to the reunion this year and bring your photos? Your graveyard stories would be a real hit. Miight even be able to coax Geoff to come too.

Tyler

hm. I'll see if we can get Keith over, maybe dust off some '86s,

Ed

[1989ZR1#74]

The cars that had real VIN numbers were, for all intents and purposes, production cars. Anything that is missing from the car was done in the hands of the tech schools or cannibals along the way. There are/ were a few more in the hands of technical schools and other obscure museums-race shops that you wouldn't normally think about.

Ed

Ed Not true. This car was not like the others. See the SPI:

AR9 Manual European seats
UM6: Non bose radio
60C Saddle Cloth Seats
Missing AQ9 Sports Seats

http://www.syreal.com/004spi.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

Now #074 is has all the ZR-1 interior options:

http://www.syreal.com/spi.jpg

[Tyler Townsley]

hm. I'll see if we can get Keith over, maybe dust off some '86s,

Ed

Would be an interesting collection 86,88,89. Maybe we could get one of the narrow body units from the heritage.

Tyler

[Blue Flame Restorations]

Smithsonian Morrison Car:
http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/corvette-photos/data/643/2DCP_0400.JPG

Here is the same car now, unless there were two of them. There "are" subtle differences between the two cars.

http://i46.tinypic.com/8zl2k9.jpg

[Tyler Townsley]

Ed Not true. This car was not like the others. See the SPI:

AR9 Manual European seats
UM6: Non bose radio
60C Saddle Cloth Seats
Missing AQ9 Sports Seats

http://www.syreal.com/004spi.jpg

Car was built on 88 production line. Thats what the 'after 6920' means on the spi. ie build behind 88 s/n 6920. Mine has same info on build sheet but on the 87 production line.

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Yes on 4/19/88 if you look at the build sheet fragment on about page 6 of this thread you will see it says "kick in behind 16920".

[zedrone]

Would be an interesting collection 86,88,89. Maybe we could get one of the narrow body units from the heritage.

Tyler

What ever happened to Geoff's '87?

heck, for that matter, what ever happened to Rupp's '89, Yager's, and Roebuck's?

Ed

[1989ZR1#74]

What ever happened to Geoff's '87?

heck, for that matter, what ever happened to Rupp's '89, Yager's, and Roebuck's?

Ed

Mike Yeager's #080

http://content.mamotorworks.com/mygarage/89lt5.htm

[vettebrett]

[QUOTE=1989ZR1#74;80881]THe record car at the museum no longer has a vin it has a EX

[vettebrett]

THe record car at the museum no longer has a vin it has a EX plate so I can't confirm that it is 045 or not and there is a record clone out there. Is the museum car the clone or the real one? I don't know. Hopefully someday it can be confirmed. (I would not break the bank buying back #045 on my circumstantial evidence based on P numbers)

The V12 confimed VIN is #040 it has a P number of P9Y074
The NCM record car has a P number of P9Y079. I guess all I know for sure is NCM was 5 Y engineering cars later. FWIW

I am new here but I have been doing research for a Corvette Race Car book and that has led me down a path about Tommy Morrison so this information about these cars comes directly from the director of the heritage collection.

Now there is 1 car from Ft Stockton and it sits in the museum, the second car which is pictured in these first 3 photos is a prototype 1989 ZR-1 that is #13, this has been verified thru the heritage collection. The car has not been seen for 10 yrs or more. It has been tucked away and the original owners are trying to get it back but are running into problems.

This cars location is only really known by about 6 people and the bad thing is we can't talk about it.


The second car was done as a press car that was done up just like the real one, it was used for photo shoots with magazines, and for ads for Goodyear.

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e191/brettrichmond/4-1.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e191/brettrichmond/1990-LandSpeedRecord-LT5ZR1-03.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e191/brettrichmond/1990LT5RecordCar-TommyMorrison-1.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e191/brettrichmond/1990-ZR1LT5-LandspeedRcord-06.jpg

[Tyler Townsley]

************

Now there is 1 car from Ft Stockton and it sits in the museum, the second car which is pictured in these first 3 photos is a prototype 1989 ZR-1 that is #13, this has been verified thru the heritage collection. The car has not been seen for 10 yrs or more. It has been tucked away and the original owners are trying to get it back but are running into problems.

*****************

Having spent 3 years getting the 88 protype running I can attest to how hard it is to get one running. I don't think Mike Y has his 89 running yet. I posted some 89 wiring diagrams above that may help. If you need other help just PM me.

Tyler
.

[Tyler Townsley]

What ever happened to Geoff's '87?


Ed
Geoffs car is an 88 year model built on the 87 line, it was built after mine.. I posted the info in an earlier post. The car is in Mich and he is restoring it. Long ago he found some body pannels from some of the 88s they were destroying. Capt Kirk had them for storage for awhile along with a couple of phase 2 motors.

Roebucks car is in a car collection in Ind last I heard. The original motor is at SGC in georgia.

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

I am new here but I have been doing research for a Corvette Race Car book and that has led me down a path about Tommy Morrison so this information about these cars comes directly from the director of the heritage collection.

Now there is 1 car from Ft Stockton and it sits in the museum, the second car which is pictured in these first 3 photos is a prototype 1989 ZR-1 that is #13, this has been verified thru the heritage collection. The car has not been seen for 10 yrs or more. It has been tucked away and the original owners are trying to get it back but are running into problems.

This cars location is only really known by about 6 people and the bad thing is we can't talk about it.

The second car was done as a press car that was done up just like the real one, it was used for photo shoots with magazines, and for ads for Goodyear.


"Heart of the Beast" talks about the replica on page 123. The only difference is it ,#013, has a stock gas tank. Eric

[1989ZR1#74]

Daily update:
Cleaned off some of the paint in the passenger side front wheel well
Had a used gatorback mounted to the drivers front rim. The original tire was not repairable.
Added a Museum and ZR1Registry decal.
Spot cleaned the carpets
Replaced the missing hood emblem.


http://www.syreal.com/drivetire.JPG

Before:
http://www.syreal.com/wheelwellbefore.JPG

After:
http://www.syreal.com/passwheelwellafter.JPG

http://www.syreal.com/decal.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

Cleaned up the driver side wiring:
http://www.syreal.com/drhush.jpg

http://www.syreal.com/hoodemb.jpg

http://www.syreal.com/keychain.jpg

[Blue Flame Restorations]

Looks like you're having fun, Eric. Must be a blast!

[1989ZR1#74]

Looks like you're having fun, Eric. Must be a blast!


Not quite up to Blue Flame specifications yet, but it is fun fixing the easy stuff.

[Blue Flame Restorations]

Not quite up to Blue Flame specifications yet, but it is fun fixing the easy stuff.


Eric. Was the car originally Dark Red Metallic? What color are you going to leave it as? Your cleaning is looking pretty good to me!

The archaeological digs are the most fun part of the "just purchased" experience.

[1989ZR1#74]

Eric. Was the car originally Dark Red Metallic? What color are you going to leave it as? Your cleaning is looking pretty good to me!

The archaeological digs are the most fun part of the "just purchased" experience.


I agree 100%. Like when I found the missing power key under the drivers seat! :jawdrop: Car was DRM, painted Bright red and then the multi layered black/dark metallic blue. Ultimately I think it should go back to DRM. I am waiting to learn more about what Campbell-Ewald did with the car. Probably DRM next year... Car needs to be stripped though. Lots of paint on it now.

[Blue Flame Restorations]

I agree 100%. Like when I found the missing power key under the drivers seat! :jawdrop: Car was DRM, painted Bright red and then the multi layered black/dark metallic blue. Ultimately I think it should go back to DRM. I am waiting to learn more about what Campbell-Ewald did with the car. Probably DRM next year... Car needs to be stripped though. Lots of paint on it now.

I know a good shop in IN that can do the re-paint. :mrgreen:

I just listed my Unconverted Challenge Car on ebay. If it sells, I'll be on the prowl for a ZR1 before the BG Gathering in May.

[1989ZR1#74]

I know a good shop in IN that can do the re-paint. :mrgreen:

Not sure how it would look in Polo White.

[Blue Flame Restorations]

:sign10:

[Tyler Townsley]

Not sure how it would look in Polo White.
http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype1/roby_1.jpg
When Brett got finished it would look like the top car. Anything later than 55 gets attacked by the c1 car dogs if it comes into his shop.

Tyler

[Blue Flame Restorations]

Tyler may have a point.......:mrgreen:

[zedrone]

Its just a lot of little jobs.

Ed

[Blue Flame Restorations]

I'd give my left @#$!!! to rebuild a crushed car.

[Tyler Townsley]

Hi All,

Thanks for the invite Tyler.

All of the '86- newer cars would have come with an 8k tach from the factory.
We never figured out how this interface worked on the '86, so we went around it.

Ed

Fore those who do not know ED here is an intrduction. He has been around for a long time. He is the discoveror of the graveyard.

http://www.zr1netregistry.com/ZR1_story.htm#4

What I found was there is a oil pressure sensor on input on the 89 and earlier cars. If you do not get oil pressure, you get no fuel pressure and the injectors do not fire. In the 90 and later it looks for a tach signal from the dis module. Took me 2 years to finally figure this out. I ran a wire to the oil pressure sensor and it worked.

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Tyler may have a point.......:mrgreen:

It's parked by a bunch of early C1s right now. It has lasted two weeks in the dark with them so far. So I bet it could hold it's own. If anything happened to it The C1 dogs would have to answer to it's big sister 53#286. Not to mention a 61 RPO 687 fuelie.

[Blue Flame Restorations]

It's tough to beat up on The King Of The Hill. I wonder if four 53's might give it a tough fight though. I have four of them here right now. They get hungry from time to time. #067, #096, #245, #274. Only two are mine though. The other two are in the home stretch of their frame-offs. They're kept company by an 89 and two 90's and two 54's. It's getting crowded.

I need a shop like Erics!

[zedrone]

Fore those who do not know ED here is an intrduction. He has been around for a long time. He is the discoveror of the graveyard.

http://www.zr1netregistry.com/ZR1_story.htm#4

What I found was there is a oil pressure sensor on input on the 89 and earlier cars. If you do not get oil pressure, you get no fuel pressure and the injectors do not fire. In the 90 and later it looks for a tach signal from the dis module. Took me 2 years to finally figure this out. I ran a wire to the oil pressure sensor and it worked.

Tyler
Its always the simple stuff. We went through three chips that supposedly had the VATS disabled (and didn't). Hearing that Phase I light off for the first time, run on 4 cylinders, then 5, 6, and finally 8 was one of the best moments of my life. Five years of unbelievable blood, sweat, and tears.

Ed

[Z51JEFF]

Does anybody know how many of these early cars were Metallic Red?I was just going through my 91 owners kit looking for something and theres a picture of the back of a MR car in the small info book.

[1989ZR1#74]

Does anybody know how many of these early cars were Metallic Red?I was just going through my 91 owners kit looking for something and theres a picture of the back of a MR car in the small info book.

At least 6...

004 (DRM/Saddle w/saddle seat backs)
at least 4 that went to Europe (Car labeled #6 DRM/Saddle w/black seat backs)
078 (DRM/Black)

Can you scan the picture? What color is the interior?

[1989ZR1#74]

Earlier I posed a question to John Heinricy about the Driver Information Center (DIC) Full power light not being present on #004 as it is on #074. It appears that the other Pilots are also missing the Full Power Light as seen in the Yellow Riverside early press introduction ZR-1:

http://www.syreal.com/batterylightyellownewsm.jpg

[1989ZR1#74]

Ther Red/Red Riverside Pilot also had the battery "L98" DIC:

Note This Pilot has the 8000 RPM Tach.

http://www.syreal.com/batterylightred.jpg

[Heinrocket]

Hi all. I have not been able to get back on since the site move until today. I thought I was more IT literate but...
I'll try to pick where this thread has gone since last week.
Later

[1989ZR1#74]

John, Glad to have you back. Is there a difference between a YE8 Engineering Test car and a WD1 Pilot car? or are those RPO codes interchangeable? Eric

[1989ZR1#74]

I determined #004's internal GM number today. Corvettes White was kind enough to share the fragments of #010's build sheet with me and I just realized that the order number for #010 appears to be it's P number:

P9Y066

http://www.syreal.com/pnumber066.jpg

Using that info I went back to the fragment of #004 build sheet and found this in the order number:

http://www.syreal.com/snumber.jpg

So I think S9YKH1 is its internal number 9 = 89 Y = Corvette,
S = Sales?
KH1= King of the Hill 1?

Any thoguhts? Eric

[1989ZR1#74]

John, What was the criteria for assigning an EX#? For example, your snake skinner had a standard VIN: #081 but Snake skinner II had EX6153? Thanks Eric

[Z51JEFF]

At least 6...

004 (DRM/Saddle w/saddle seat backs)
at least 4 that went to Europe (Car labeled #6 DRM/Saddle w/black seat backs)
078 (DRM/Black)

Can you scan the picture? What color is the interior?

The picture is of the back of the car and theres no interior shot.

[1989ZR1#74]

The picture is of the back of the car and theres no interior shot.

Hmmmm... can you take a pix of it? Any quality will do.

[Heinrocket]

John, What was the criteria for assigning an EX#? For example, your snake skinner had a standard VIN: #081 but Snake skinner II had EX6153? Thanks Eric

Vehicles with a VIN usually meant a pilot or production vehicle. The EX number, if applied by the plant meant that it was some kind of prototype. Experimental! These vehicles had to be paid for out of budget immediately and would be used for some kind of testing and presumably would never be sold, but would be scrapped out.
Some VIN vehicles were turned into EX vehicles when enough experimental parts were installed to where the vehicle would become experimental. Discpline on this was not that great though

[Heinrocket]

Vehicles with a VIN usually meant a pilot or production vehicle. The EX number, if applied by the plant meant that it was some kind of prototype. Experimental! These vehicles had to be paid for out of budget immediately and would be used for some kind of testing and presumably would never be sold, but would be scrapped out.
Some VIN vehicles were turned into EX vehicles when enough experimental parts were installed to where the vehicle would become experimental. Discpline on this was not that great though

So Snakeskinner ll was never a pilot but was a prototype. It probably started as a 1987 or 1988 car.

[Heinrocket]

So Snakeskinner ll was never a pilot but was a prototype. It probably started as a 1987 or 1988 car.

Now that I said that, it could have been a 1989 that was turned into an EX number, but i thought it was an earlier car than that

[Tyler Townsley]

I determined #004's internal GM number today. Corvettes White was kind enough to share the fragments of #010's build sheet with me and I just realized that the order number for #010 appears to be it's P number:

P9Y066

http://www.syreal.com/pnumber066.jpg

Using that info I went back to the fragment of #004 build sheet and found this in the order number:

http://www.syreal.com/snumber.jpg

So I think S9YKH1 is its internal number 9 = 89 Y = Corvette,
S = Sales?
KH1= King of the Hill 1?

Any thoguhts? Eric

The P mumber is what GM useed to kep track of these cars. If there is info filed it will be filed under that number.

http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype/87_build.jpg

This is a copy of what was in the frame of mime which means it was on the frame build part of car as it went down the line. When the body was dropped on the frame a worker put the 'extra' sheet in the frame. Eric you can get a copy of the build sheet from the NCM.
On this document you can see all the numbers tied togeather on one page. The ex # and p# in the KOH line and the actual assembly line build on the top right. I have never seen the rpo codes lined out like this except on the 88 prototypes like mine, I can only assume the build computer did not have them programmed as options yet.

Tyler

[Tyler Townsley]

Now that I said that, it could have been a 1989 that was turned into an EX number, but i thought it was an earlier car than that

The telling number is the frame vin that can then be checked against this.

http://deliquescence.net/~tyler/prototype/87_89production.jpg

That will tell you what the car started out as off the production line.

Tyler

[Heinrocket]

After the cancelation and move to the 1990 MY there must have been 50 89 ZR-1s lying around. Has there ever been that many unsaleable "project" cars to play with? It seems like so many "fun" EX cars came out of that group. In the long run did having those "Engineer Units" available make the ZR-1 project better? Eric

once it was decided not to sell these cars, it certainly did give us the largest group of project cars imaginable. having them did help to make sure the 90s were as good as they could be.

[1989ZR1#74]

The P mumber is what GM useed to kep track of these cars. If there is info filed it will be filed under that number.

Tyler

I think P cars were not mutually exclusive. #074 was 9PR110. No "P" nor Y. This car is an "S" I am sure GM had a S group. So it's "P" number is S9YKH1 if that makes any sense. My space on the build sheet does not have the same info yours has. No EX# No P number. THis car belonged to the Chevy Photography/Campbell-Ewald. A whole different group. (which is probably why it is still here. John and his guys seemed to chew up those P numbers. Not to many of those left anymore but at least 5 PR cars are still here.)

[1989ZR1#74]

once it was decided not to sell these cars, it certainly did give us the largest group of project cars imaginable. having them did help to make sure the 90s were as good as they could be.

I always thought that must have been true. The golden age of the C4. Thanks for that info. I remember seeing your Snake SKinner at the NCRS Spring Fiesta here in Scottsdale back in 1993. Up until last year it was the only 89 ZR-1 I had ever seen in person. It was, and is amazing. Eric

[1989ZR1#74]

Vehicles with a VIN usually meant a pilot or production vehicle. The EX number, if applied by the plant meant that it was some kind of prototype. Experimental! These vehicles had to be paid for out of budget immediately and would be used for some kind of testing and presumably would never be sold, but would be scrapped out.
Some VIN vehicles were turned into EX vehicles when enough experimental parts were installed to where the vehicle would become experimental. Discpline on this was not that great though


It appears SSII had it's EX tag added later and the number is much higher then the 90 Active sold at BJ 2009:

Note standard POP rivets I bet the windshield date code is at least 2 years newer then the car.
http://www.syreal.com/ssiivin.jpg

Compared to 1990 Active:

http://www.syreal.com/90activevin.JPG


Note rosette rivets (and windshield delam!)

[1989ZR1#74]

Vehicles with a VIN usually meant a pilot or production vehicle. The EX number, if applied by the plant meant that it was some kind of prototype. Experimental! These vehicles had to be paid for out of budget immediately and would be used for some kind of testing and presumably would never be sold, but would be scrapped out.
Some VIN vehicles were turned into EX vehicles when enough experimental parts were installed to where the vehicle would become experimental. Discpline on this was not that great though


So current EX cars have a VIN that almost looks like a normal VIN except for EX in the middle?

[Blue Flame Restorations]

Wouldn't the EX plate be seperate "if" the car started life as a production model, such as the early Corvettes with Engineering or Styling EX numbers? Was that the same OP during the C4 era or would a "Rev number" follow the car once ISO became the norm?

I worked in the GM system with Delphi, Magnequench and Guide Divisions for several years during the 90's and 00's. Once ISO became a way of life, Rev #'s followed any deviation from the norm.

[zedrone]

What happened to the Yellow '89 that was to be raffled by the NCM? At some stage "they" claimed an issue because of the "X" digit in the VIN....

Ed

[1989ZR1#74]

What happened to the Yellow '89 that was to be raffled by the NCM? At some stage "they" claimed an issue because of the "X" digit in the VIN....

Ed

If they failed to raffle off the Geneva Show car because it has an X in it's VIN it was saved for all Corvettekind because of a common mistake.

The VIN of #016 is:

1G1YZ21JXK5800016

The X has nothing to do with it being experimental. It is it's "Check Digit". When the Check digit = 10 'X' is used. No mystery. On average 10% of all production cars have an X. I see people selling corvettes on Ebay claiming the have a prototype only to find out their check digit = 10.

Thats almost funny.

Eric


UPDATE:

I think i have it wrong the Check digit for #016 should be 0 so this should be it:

1G1YZ21J0K5800016

[-=Jeff=-]

This Yellow one?
http://vettextc.jiminees.com/jeff/FVCC_BG_Trip/images/dx6490_096.jpg

http://vettextc.jiminees.com/jeff/FVCC_BG_Trip/images/dx6490_141.jpg

Pictures are from Early August 2009 at the NCM

[zedrone]

If they failed to raffle off the Geneva Show car because it has an X in it's VIN it was saved for all Corvettekind because of a common mistake.

The VIN of #016 is:

1G1YZ21JXK5800016

The X has nothing to do with it being experimental. It is it's "Check Digit". When the Check digit = 0 or 10 'X' is used. No mystery. On average 10% of all production cars have an X. I see people selling corvettes on Ebay claiming the have a prototype only to find out their check digit = 10.

Thats almost funny.

Eric

Yeah, we knew it was a crock at the time, but things used to be a lot more political.

Ed

[Tyler Townsley]

So current EX cars have a VIN that almost looks like a normal VIN except for EX in the middle?

Its actually at the end. I saw a couple of the early Z06s and it was a production looking vin with EX at the end.

Tyler

[Tyler Townsley]

What happened to the Yellow '89 that was to be raffled by the NCM? At some stage "they" claimed an issue because of the "X" digit in the VIN....

Ed

Probably did not have an MSO for the car and selling on a salvage title was not done by GM at the time.

Tyler

[1989ZR1#74]

Its actually at the end. I saw a couple of the early Z06s and it was a production looking vin with EX at the end.

Tyler

Ah, Faith restored... I was wrong anyway the check digit it 0 not X.

Anyone have a picture of that vin?

[phrogs]

Probably did not have an MSO for the car and selling on a salvage title was not done by GM at the time.

Tyler


Nope but its regular practice now that the government is involved made them sell the toys!

[Blue Flame Restorations]

Is there anyway to title the cars that GM sells as salvage? Silly question, I know.:rolleyes:

[1989ZR1#74]

Is there anyway to title the cars that GM sells as salvage? Silly question, I know.:rolleyes:

For cars this old...

Salvage title = almost always yes
Scrap title (Junk)= Almost always no

In AZ it requires a level 3 inspection and receipts showing what you fixed.

[1989ZR1#74]

Hey Brett "off topic" but is the 1954 Fastback Motorama Car the Corvair?

[LGAFF]

A kit car, however not sure if state would retag the VIN

[Blue Flame Restorations]

Hey Brett "off topic" but is the 1954 Fastback Motorama Car the Corvair?

Yes, I'm in the process of building it now. I just pulled the roof panel from the mold the Friday before the NCRS Winter Regional. I took it to the show to display it.
http://i46.tinypic.com/27xi70o.jpg
http://i46.tinypic.com/6ztr14.jpg

[Z51JEFF]

Hey Brett "off topic" but is the 1954 Fastback Motorama Car the Corvair?

I was just getting ready to P.M. Brett on this....................then I saw the post.

[Tyler Townsley]

Yes, I'm in the process of building it now. I just pulled the roof panel from the mold the Friday before the NCRS Winter Regional. I took it to the show to display it.
http://i46.tinypic.com/27xi70o.jpg
http://i46.tinypic.com/6ztr14.jpg

Trouble was the 53 #29 stole the show.

Tyler

[Blue Flame Restorations]

I was more than happy to help 029 steal the show. My pleasure.....

Now, let's find me a ZR1!!!!!!!!