Rule Number 5

[Dynomite]

I am not so sure what is meant by the phrase rather than disagreeing with their post in the context presented. I guess what I am saying is that I do not know any reason one has to suggest a disagreement. Just tell us your own thinking and let the reader decide if in fact your opinion is different or in any disagreement without you pointing out negatively the others point of view. Maybe my variant below is too lengthy but the Rule#5 is important enough to describe in more detail me thinks.

Current Rule Number 5.
5. Racial or offensive language/jokes, as well as defamatory, obscene, vulgar, hateful, or threatening statements are prohibited. Posts may not attack other members, rather than disagreeing with their post, and includes the use of or implying derogatory meanings or inference to disparage others. We are comprised of diverse backgrounds and everyone should feel at home here.

A different variant of Rule Number 5 for consideration.
5. Racial or other offensive language/jokes, defamatory, obscene, vulgar, hateful, or threatening statements are prohibited. This includes posting insinuating references to others in a negative way. Language in posts may not be negative in a disparaging way toward others and includes the use of or implying derogatory meanings or inference to disparage others. Post language that expresses different opinions without assessing the opinions of others in a negative way are welcome. We are comprised of diverse backgrounds, expertise, and experiences. Everyone should feel at home and at ease in posting different opinions. This includes different ways of accomplishing technical tasks or the selection of different components for the same tasks in this forum General/Technical ZR-1 Sections. In that regard, just tell us how you would accomplish the maintenance, repair, modification yourself.

As an aside......I know I get into trouble with too much detail in posts and my only defense is that I am always writing for the New guy on the block that may not know what a Plenum is or what TDC means
Oh...and I use too many smilies.......but that is just me
And Highlighting as I do kind of took off with others seeing that benefit in communicating technical information

Also....just a potential edit of rule#13
13. Although the administrators and moderators of ZR-1 Net Registry Forums will attempt to keep all objectionable messages off this forum, it is impossible for us to review all messages. All messages express the views of the author, and neither the owners of ZR-1 Net Registry Forums, nor Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. (developers of vBulletin) will be held responsible for the content of any message. The owners of ZR-1 Net Registry Forums reserve the right to remove, edit, move or close any thread for any reason.

I think you mean for any reason cited in Rules 1 through 12.

[QB93Z]

Thank you for your comments Cliff. I will consider your suggestions when we do the next update of the Rules.

Jim

[Hog]

Cliff, a small scenerio.

Scenario Start
Discussion about torque specs on the Space Shuttle Main Engines that will be reused for the SLS rocket due top be launched in 2017.
Someone types the statement "the high pressere turbopump retainer bolts get torqued to 54 lb ft"
The inproper way for me to present a differing opinion would be "No dumbass, the high pressure turbopump retainer bolts gets torqued to only 50 lb ft of torque, idiot-stick, BTW I HEARD your cheque for registry dues bounced-AGAIN! Get your sh*t and your advice together"

The proper way to present a differing opinion would be "According to the NASA-2014 Space Launch System's-Turbomachinery Torque Value Book, the high pressure turbopump retainer states that the high pressure turbopump retainers must be torqued to 50 lb/ft.

End of scenario
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

It's a sad state where as part of a car club that we must have rules regarding conduct, but that doesn't diminish the fact that when things go wrong, that there must be an accurate matrix that must be followed.
A thought I have about participating in public AND members only forums. When making posts, pretend that the person you are adressing is right in front of you, and that there are a lot of people that can hear what you are saying.
Also if you are experiencing an emotional reaction when responding to a post you have just read, leave your response un-sent for 5 minutes, then go back to it and re-read your response. In my personal experience, there has been many times where I simply erase my potential response.

I think that the message that there are consequences to your participation on social media, you simply cant type what you wish. Up here there are govermental sponsored advertisements about anti-bullying and hate type messaging and how there can be police involvement if it's reported.

As it pertains to this site, and I wish I could give credit where credit is due, but some one said "It;s supposed to be fun" and it really is. The guys that have the pleasure of owning a C4 ZR-1 and the enthusiasts like myself are the ones that will help to keep car clubs like the Registry in operation. If the clubs die, the ZR-1 will be relegated to being a trailer queen/museum madam with only people having deep pockets being able to drive them like they were designed to do. Freely flowing info on LT5/ZR-1 maintenance would cease, communication of parts needs would cease, it would be much more difficult to be a C4/ZR-1 owner/driver.
The ZR-1 is a special car, the manner in which RPO ZR1 and LT5 came about will not happen again. There is a great variety to suit all walks of auto life. You can easily get into a 1990 car as they made so many comparativley, and have a quick car that some would have no issues driving. Then at the other end of the spectrum, is the potential of the much lower production 1995 cars with certain details like the Birmal/Dunn manufacturere change that up the allure of a double Dunn head car, that some people might search for in a coillector/ownership capacity. After only a couple years in production, the car was on the chopping block and being killed already. LT5 engines built at Mercruiser for wide-assed cars that were years away from coming off of Bowling Green assembly line. The car that had an "option" that literally doubled the price of the car, the car that fought for distiction from the narrow-assed sister and the engine that fought with 2 little sisters, the L98 and the LT1. The car that ran at WOT for 24 hours setting world records, the car that made you excited if there was talk that the plenum had a black coloured crinkle paint.(Black Widow).
I cant think of a car that had such a unique combination of engine/chassis development, international promotional tours, bang for buck when comapred to the best of the best European and other countries-yet is civil enough to sit there and idle smoothly without issue. Usage of new processes, while bringing in other countries/companies in order to get the job done. A very very unique process and environment in which the car came to be. IMO it's amazing that the C4 ZR-1 with its LT5 engine actually made it to production. We must "keep the dream alive" as this is a great car involving great American history. The "ZR-1 Net Registry is THE resource for the ZR-1/LT5, to lose it would be a headshot to the plight of the ZR-1 Corvette community.

I apologize for the book, but I had some time, and I'm sensing tension, these personal thoughts of mine are directed at no one specifically, just generally towards the membership. This is a great car, and a great bunch of guys, it would be great to remain great, in all its greatness.

Have a great days guys.
Paul Schermerhorn

Oh, BTW, I was happy to see some of the previous generation of t-shirts for sale at the Registry store. They were priced great so I added a couple extra to my membership dues payment. I plyed with eth sizing a bit, my 2013 blue shirt fit a bit loose at XXL, so I 2 more XXL's and an XL just too check it out. Unfortunatley the week after I I got my 2013 shirt, I was adding chlorine to the pool and got some splashback on teh shirt. I didnt even realize it until a buddy said, Why are there whitre spots on your shirt? No matter I replaced it with the 2014 membership re-upp.
Buying up those older t-shirts is a great way to not only recoup some costs, but also reduce inventory. Heck $5.00 is the steal of a century for any quality t-shirt, let alone any that have pictures of LT5's and references to ZR-1 Corvettes.

[Dynomite]

Originally Posted by Hog

Cliff, a small scenerio.

Scenario Start
Discussion about torque specs on the Space Shuttle Main Engines that will be reused for the SLS rocket due top be launched in 2017.
Someone types the statement "the high pressere turbopump retainer bolts get torqued to 54 lb ft"
The inproper way for me to present a differing opinion would be "No dumbass, the high pressure turbopump retainer bolts gets torqued to only 50 lb ft of torque, idiot-stick, BTW I HEARD your cheque for registry dues bounced-AGAIN! Get your sh*t and your advice together"

The proper way to present a differing opinion would be "According to the NASA-2014 Space Launch System's-Turbomachinery Torque Value Book, the high pressure turbopump retainer states that the high pressure turbopump retainers must be torqued to 50 lb/ft.

End of scenario

Perfect Example ....and Perfect Response (the last paragraph)
You can respond to any thread/post with just plain factual information without suggesting the other persons information is wrong or miss leading...then let the viewer make his/her own decision.

I kind of like your first response also
And sometimes hard to hold back

But great example of what I was talking about......thanks

[Racinfan83]

I'm a moderator on another auto forum with about 35k members. And we have some "problems" - as you will with any internet forum. So I have seen a lot of stuff both good and bad. And let me tell you that if the mods over there let things begin to get out of hand - it goes bad in a HURRY. I have met several members of that site in person - and every one was a cool friendly guy. But it's amazing how that can sometimes change when you sit behind a keyboard with no real idea of who you are conversing with. I think the "sit back and re-read your post" is a good idea. I've been guilty of "emotional posting" more then once - and it will probably happen again. But I try - and if I was in the wrong I would admit it and go on with life.
This site is the reason I own my Z - if I had not come here to research the car before I did the deal I would not own it. My wife and I saw the HUGE amount of info here, and especially Dynomites links, and decided we could get the car and be able to diagnose/fix/research anything we needed. So yes - the site is a vital part of the ZR-1 community - and must be kept up...
Thanks Guys!

[scottfab]

I really hope this does not start a hate storm now.

We are seriously considering banning the words "I disagree...." ?
Seriously?

When I see a post that misleads or is dangerous or not in the best interest of the preservation of the car I feel obligated to say so.

I do NOT think saying "I disagree......" is something to be banned.

Example Post:
"it is ok to smoke while working on the fuel system"

A possible reply:
"I disagree. It is a common practice to not smoke when working around fuel"

So now the new improved way in order to follow the proposed new Rule 5 would require someone to write,

"I am so very sorry but I have a different opinion. It is a common practice to not smoke when working around fuel"

Or

"Please forgive me but I see it differently. It is a common practice to not smoke when working around fuel"

Or.

"My understanding is, it is a common practice to not smoke when working around fuel"

Really?

Let's not try to regulate words or read between the lines on what may or may not have been meant. This is not North Korea or China. Wielding too much control can have really bad consequences.

Just my opinion based on the country we live in (oh and Canada )
They are meant to be in the best interest of the club.

[Dynomite]

Here...let me give it a try......responding to this hypothetical statement made by a guy just fresh out of kindergarten "it is ok to smoke while working on the fuel system"

Hi.....Gasoline can light up your smoke BIG TIME
See Dangers of smoking around fuel tanks

So....how can I help you with your fuel system issues

It is a much more difficult position to suggest you disagree with someone else (or lecture them) vice just state your position.

In this example.....lets leave it to the viewers to determine who has the better position or if in fact there is a disagreement regarding smoking around fuel tanks....

I just presented some facts and no need for me to debate any further.....I do not need to say the individual is wrong, or try every trick in the book not to offend the guy from kindergarten as I did not evaluate his understanding....just presented my understanding.

If the individual responds wanting to debate.....I will just say OK......and move on to questions from High School Graduates

I would NOT say this in any post response....but this is my general philosophy

You cannot fix stupid.
I can explain it to you but I cannot understand it for you.

I am being tested

[Fully Vetted]

Originally Posted by Hog

...Also if you are experiencing an emotional reaction when responding to a post you have just read, leave your response un-sent for 5 minutes, then go back to it and re-read your response. In my personal experience, there has been many times where I simply erase my potential response.

That is excellent and very useful advise. It's amazing how brave some people get when they can respond from 1,000 miles away without fear of getting a mud hole stomped in their ***. I have a perfect example. I was involved in a thread last year when then this JetJock fella I had never talked to or had any dealings with chimed in and to me pretty much laid me out cold. I can't remember what the topic was about now. That shows how important it was. Anyway, man I was hot. So I typed up this response that could've been measured on a Richter scale, saved it, put in on my desktop and walked away.

I'm glad I did.

In a later conversation with David Johnson I happened to bring up this prick Roy and David was like, "No, you just need to meet the guy. He didn't mean anything by it. He's a cool dude. You won't have any problems with him." So, BG 2013 rolls around and I'm taking Gordon's class and low and behold who do I run into but Mr. JetJock himself. We immediately hit it off and I'm proud to call him my friend today. How differently would that totally unnecessary response have played out on the boards? We'd still be going back and forth and it would've cost both of us the opportunity to gain a friendship.

Email, texts and forum responses can be very dangerous unless you're responding to someone you know on a personal level. All the recipient is getting is a one dimensional response. Only words. They can't see expressions or the little smile as your typing. You may be saying something funny that could be read as totally different. I know the people on this forum that I can give a bad time too; Roy being one of them. They know me and can picture me saying what I'm typing. Everyone else get's a different kind of response. And I'm a smart *** Texan at heart so that's not always the easiest thing for me to do!

[Dynomite]

Originally Posted by Fully Vetted

I know the people on this forum that I can give a bad time too; Roy being one of them. They know me and can picture me saying what I'm typing. Everyone else get's a different kind of response. And I'm a smart *** Texan at heart so that's not always the easiest thing for me to do!

Say.........Can I put you down as one I can tease a little? And any one else that I can have a little fun with.
Sign up here

Any one that can take a little ribbing

[scottfab]

Originally Posted by Fully Vetted

...snip...
Email, texts and forum responses can be very dangerous unless you're responding to someone you know on a personal level. All the recipient is getting is a one dimensional response. Only words. They can't see expressions or the little smile as your typing. You may be saying something funny that could be read as totally different.
...snip...

That's really it in a nut shell isn't it.
It's not just care in typing but care in how you read it.

Controlling what words are taboo is not it. IMHO

If all else fails, just take care in who you respond to at all.
I truly believe if what is "meant" is in the best interest of the car in the
end those who really care about the car will accept it even if they don't agree with it.