Y/T DataMaster vid with throttle movement... - Page 2 - ZR-1 Net Registry Forums

Schrade · 08-06-2013

YikES! 94 pages DataMaster User's Guide .pdf !

Can't print THAT out, and can't read the laptop in the 'library', where my throne has a hole in the middle

Schrade · 08-06-2013

OK - how long should a recording be (in order to not create a ridiculous LONG file for posting here), should I make???

And only in Closed Loop, I guess?

And should it be a 'Road Test' for better diagnostic data???

FIRST thing I'm looking for is the Cruise Control problem, of the 2 MPH swing......

Franke · 08-06-2013

Schrade,

It shouldn't take too long to gather the data needed. I think you said that it doesn't sag when you ease into it from idle but does when you romp on it. Does it do it all the time, for ex. in open loop mode while warming up or only in closed loop after warmup? That might help you to decide how long a test.

Schrade · 08-06-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franke

Schrade,

It shouldn't take too long to gather the data needed. I think you said that it doesn't sag when you ease into it from idle but does when you romp on it. Does it do it all the time, for ex. in open loop mode while warming up or only in closed loop after warmup? That might help you to decide how long a test.

NoSIR - petty much the opposite - it DOES sag / delay (WITHOUT STUMBLE) on slow pedal - even bounces RPM's briefly just a TAD (IF YOU TRY TO HOLD STEADY AT THAT POINT!!! ), and when the auto shifts, on a slow pedal, it does it then too, at low RPM, in each gear.

After TPS exceeds 'X' position, in it's range of motion, in each gear, it's smooth as glass TPS response...

If I can't get soon from TTS DM how to initiate a scan, I'll just post another vid that might reveal something here...

and thanks for helpin' again there Franke... You picking up anything here?

When you help, and THINK, on another's problem, you can sometimes learn something yourself - not necessarily about THAT problem, but just HOW TO think problems out!!!

This one is diggin' on me - that's for SURE!!!

WHY CAN I HOLD A STEADY HIGHWAY SPEED WITH THE MECHANICAL LINKAGE, BUT CRUISE CONTROL CANNOT. IT SWINGS 2MPH. AND AT LOW THROTTLE POSITION, THERE'S 'UNSTEADINESS - SAG' JUST AS PEDAL COMES OFF 0% THROTTLE???

???

Franke · 08-07-2013

Sounds like 2 problems. MAP sensor voltage varies with intake manifold vacuum. The MAP can be tested on the car or off with a vacuum pump and voltmeter as per the FSM. When slow pedal - multiple things are happening. Voltage starts changing in the TPS to the ECM and Manifold vacuum starts dropping back toward atmospheric pressure changing the MAP voltage to the ECM. Possibly since everything goes to and from the ECM, did you try another ECM? I'm runnin' out of ideas here.

Cruise uses electrical, vacuum and mechanical links. I think the Cruise issue is a seperate problem. Section 9B in the FSM describes its operation but is not a lot of help. One thing I think they do have in common possibly is a vacuum leak. Did you verify all hoses and canisters integrity etc?
I once worked on a ford that had a vacuum problem that had a hose with a small crack in it. You couldn't see the crack visually and I found it by using a vacuum pump on the hose alone. Boy was I surprised when the hose couldn't hold vacuum even though it looked good.

Schrade · 08-07-2013

I'm the guru of vac leak detection, but the process doesn't apply to LT5

(and I don't even HAVE a loping idle)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schrade

Vacuum leak detection is hard to do right: I know of only one guy who did it right and found a leak (in IAC gasket):

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schrade View Post
No one got the proper technique for vacuum leak detection...

FIRST (fully warmed up motor); block the gas pedal, or block the throttle linkage. YOU HAVE TO DO THIS TO GET A STEADY IDLE , around 1,250 rpms, or a little higher. If you don't, you can fish starting fluid, a propane hose, or WD40, or Krylon, or hair spray, or pee, anything, until you need a sweater in Hades, but if the motor is lopin' idle already from a vacuum leak, you ain't gonna' find any leak, unless it's so big that Little Jack Horner can stick his thumb in it and pull out a pineapple NOPE.

AFTER you get a steady idle, THEN, you can spray starting fluid everywhere - that's the best detector, because it's vapor pressure is very high - a LITTLE at a time, all around the motor, until you get the rpm SURGE. Follow the vacuum lines to the EVAP cannister too. You might even have to follow the EVAP lines from the EVAP cannister to the gas tank too, but that vacuum leak will show up as a DTC 32 EGR fault, and won't normally show as loping idle, unless the EVAP cannister has been by-passed (been there, saw that uh-HUH yup).

If you get a surge in a tight spot, and can't tell exactly where it is, light a book of matches, blow out the match heads while they're still burnin', and feed the smoke to the tight spot to see it get drawn in.

Fear not the starting fluid; you cannot put the can down fast enough and light the matches fast enough to catch the starting fluid, because the vapor pressure is so high.

Bookmark this post YUP.

Wrench Wizard OUT!

08-06-2013	#11
Schrade Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: NC Posts: 1,786	Re: Y/T DataMaster vid with throttle movement... YikES! 94 pages DataMaster User's Guide .pdf ! Can't print THAT out, and can't read the laptop in the 'library', where my throne has a hole in the middle __________________ I'm getting my snappics / threads removed blindly as fast as I can, to get in compliance with copyright / license TOS on the boards here (lots of FSM pages and other copyright / license violations on my part; sorry guys). And thanks to all the guys who didn't whine when I posted those FSM copyrighted / licensed stuff in my threads... ( :thumbsup: [b]and to think I complied with a mod's request to delete a pic of him in a Challenge Car in NCM Museum, so he wouldn't get in hot water)[/b] Thanks to several guys here for sending parts FREE; BearlyFlying, WeGone, Geezer, GoldCylon, and more there, TonyD, mike100, fletchusmc... 1990 #2794; 4L60e Stage V by RPM Transmission, TCI Dedicated TCM, OBX Stainless, Power Effects 3" [IMG]https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-GHpfzty7DVU/UQn-0Ru2xAI/AAAAAAAAA14/08mz1p4QLD4/s445/Screenshot-5.png[/IMG]

08-06-2013	#12
Schrade Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: NC Posts: 1,786	Re: Y/T DataMaster vid with throttle movement... OK - how long should a recording be (in order to not create a ridiculous LONG file for posting here), should I make??? And only in Closed Loop, I guess? And should it be a 'Road Test' for better diagnostic data??? FIRST thing I'm looking for is the Cruise Control problem, of the 2 MPH swing...... __________________ I'm getting my snappics / threads removed blindly as fast as I can, to get in compliance with copyright / license TOS on the boards here (lots of FSM pages and other copyright / license violations on my part; sorry guys). And thanks to all the guys who didn't whine when I posted those FSM copyrighted / licensed stuff in my threads... ( :thumbsup: [b]and to think I complied with a mod's request to delete a pic of him in a Challenge Car in NCM Museum, so he wouldn't get in hot water)[/b] Thanks to several guys here for sending parts FREE; BearlyFlying, WeGone, Geezer, GoldCylon, and more there, TonyD, mike100, fletchusmc... 1990 #2794; 4L60e Stage V by RPM Transmission, TCI Dedicated TCM, OBX Stainless, Power Effects 3" [IMG]https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-GHpfzty7DVU/UQn-0Ru2xAI/AAAAAAAAA14/08mz1p4QLD4/s445/Screenshot-5.png[/IMG]

08-06-2013	#13
Franke Join Date: May 2013 Location: Beaver, PA Posts: 516	Re: Y/T DataMaster vid with throttle movement... Schrade, It shouldn't take too long to gather the data needed. I think you said that it doesn't sag when you ease into it from idle but does when you romp on it. Does it do it all the time, for ex. in open loop mode while warming up or only in closed loop after warmup? That might help you to decide how long a test.

08-07-2013	#15
Franke Join Date: May 2013 Location: Beaver, PA Posts: 516	Re: Y/T DataMaster vid with throttle movement... Sounds like 2 problems. MAP sensor voltage varies with intake manifold vacuum. The MAP can be tested on the car or off with a vacuum pump and voltmeter as per the FSM. When slow pedal - multiple things are happening. Voltage starts changing in the TPS to the ECM and Manifold vacuum starts dropping back toward atmospheric pressure changing the MAP voltage to the ECM. Possibly since everything goes to and from the ECM, did you try another ECM? I'm runnin' out of ideas here. Cruise uses electrical, vacuum and mechanical links. I think the Cruise issue is a seperate problem. Section 9B in the FSM describes its operation but is not a lot of help. One thing I think they do have in common possibly is a vacuum leak. Did you verify all hoses and canisters integrity etc? I once worked on a ford that had a vacuum problem that had a hose with a small crack in it. You couldn't see the crack visually and I found it by using a vacuum pump on the hose alone. Boy was I surprised when the hose couldn't hold vacuum even though it looked good.