1992 ZR1 Bloomington Gold Top Flight at Mecum Question ???

[Blue Flame Restorations]

There has to be two "real" bidders that want it.

[PhillipsLT5]

Killshots asked me to go, but I just had to drive my car & enjoy it, & good guys also in town, but I did watch SAT PM @ Primetime and it seemed to me, my opinions, no energy in room, cars looked like they should be middle of the week not SAT Primetime cars, sellers reserve to high, no $ in the room, lots of empty seats, lots of no sales/bid goes on, this was there 1st Phoenix auction, I really like there business model, much different from JAN auctions in Scottsdale/Phoenix area, maybe better next time, March is a great month, lots of tourism

[RussMcB]

Originally Posted by PhillipsLT5

<snip> ... I really like there business model, much different from JAN auctions in Scottsdale/Phoenix area

What's the change? You've piqued my interest. Thanks.

[PhillipsLT5]

The Jan auctions have a buyer & seller % that each pay, standard operating procedure, Mecum does also but the dealmaker Dana Mecum is willing to throw away the seller fee %, make a deal right in front of the camera with seller and strike a $ deal, not percentage, with seller to get seller to drop reserve and sell cars, he is operating on volume, like McDonalds burgers, win/win/win for buyer, seller & Mecum, he holds at least 15 auctions a year, keep in mind, all of these auctions are simply in 1 way or another just used car salesmen, but some good deals to be had for buyers and risky for seller if no reserve, I have seen sellers turn into to buyers at Barrett Jackson, to buy there car back, just so they dont get ripped off, now they pay both fees, buyer & seller

[Kevszr1]

[QUOTE=PhillipsLT5;290987]I have seen sellers turn into to buyers at Barrett Jackson, to buy there car back, just so they dont get ripped off, now they pay both fees, buyer & seller

I wouldn’t get caught being any part of a “shill bid” at any auction. And you say Barrett Jackson allows this?

[Kevszr1]

Originally Posted by PhillipsLT5

The Jan auctions have a buyer & seller % that each pay, standard operating procedure, Mecum does also but the dealmaker Dana Mecum is willing to throw away the seller fee %, make a deal right in front of the camera with seller and strike a $ deal, not percentage, with seller to get seller to drop reserve and sell cars, he is operating on volume, like McDonalds burgers, win/win/win for buyer, seller & Mecum, he holds at least 15 auctions a year, keep in mind, all of these auctions are simply in 1 way or another just used car salesmen, but some good deals to be had for buyers and risky for seller if no reserve, I have seen sellers turn into to buyers at Barrett Jackson, to buy there car back, just so they dont get ripped off, now they pay both fees, buyer & seller

I do believe you but I guess it’s just so damm shady low-life to do that, that I wouldn’t expect it at any of the big auction houses.

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

[QUOTE=Kevszr1;290992]

Originally Posted by PhillipsLT5

I have seen sellers turn into to buyers at Barrett Jackson, to buy there car back, just so they dont get ripped off, now they pay both fees, buyer & seller

I wouldn’t get caught being any part of a “shill bid” at any auction. And you say Barrett Jackson allows this?

Not really a "shill" bid.
Shill bids are when a non-real buyer ( usually in collusion with the seller) bids up a car to get other bidders to go higher, hopefully.


What was described above is a seller who took the risk of selling with no reserve, only to discover ( during the auction) that his car may sell for less than half of what it is truly worth based on slow or sluggish bidding and or not enough room interest.
Rather than lose his lets say $100,000 car for $50,000.00, he steps in and "buys" his own car back to avoid the low yield sale.
He would then owe the auction house all of their fees both on the buy and sell side.
The total fee cost however is less than what he would have " lost" if the car sold for the low bid.


Selling without a reserve is a very risky business.
It makes day trading look ultra conservative.
If you have the most desirable car in the world then the risk is minimal.
If you don't, then anything can and usually will happen, and not all of the possibilities are good ones.
Seller beware!
Marty

[PhillipsLT5]

Thank you Marty

[Kevszr1]

[QUOTE=DRM500RUBYZR-1;291004]

Originally Posted by Kevszr1

Not really a "shill" bid.
Shill bids are when a non-real buyer ( usually in collusion with the seller) bids up a car to get other bidders to go higher, hopefully.


What was described above is a seller who took the risk of selling with no reserve, only to discover ( during the auction) that his car may sell for less than half of what it is truly worth based on slow or sluggish bidding and or not enough room interest.
Rather than lose his lets say $100,000 car for $50,000.00, he steps in and "buys" his own car back to avoid the low yield sale.
He would then owe the auction house all of their fees both on the buy and sell side.
The total fee cost however is less than what he would have " lost" if the car sold for the low bid.


Selling without a reserve is a very risky business.
It makes day trading look ultra conservative.
If you have the most desirable car in the world then the risk is minimal.
If you don't, then anything can and usually will happen, and not all of the possibilities are good ones.
Seller beware!
Marty

Either way it’s a shill because it’s artificially inflating the bid and someone can bid on top of you. Again, I wouldn’t get caught doing it at any auction house. ..... it’s not allowed. That’s my only point

[spork2367]

[QUOTE=Kevszr1;291018]

Originally Posted by DRM500RUBYZR-1

Either way it’s a shill because it’s artificially inflating the bid and someone can bid on top of you. Again, I wouldn’t get caught doing it at any auction house. ..... it’s not allowed. That’s my only point

No, it's not a shill bid. Re-read Marty's post. The auction house doesn't give a crap if a buyer or seller is getting a good deal, they are only concerned about their cut. In this case, they get their cut. In fact, their cut is higher because if the seller had let it go, it would have sold for a lower number and their cut would have been less. The seller bids it up, wins, then pays a higher percentage based on the higher selling price.

If the other bidder chooses to continue bidding, they are not being forced to do so.

They absolutely allow this, although I'm sure it isn't encouraged.

A shill bid is artificially inflating the price by having a non-buyer bid. A seller can't be a shill bidder and artificially raise the price against himself as a buyer...The seller is actually going to buy the car (which is just paying the auction house fees). They are intending to buy the car should it go for less than xxx. They are a legitimate bidder. A shill bidder has no intent to buy the car.

Shill bidding can't really happen easily at a live auction where bid retractions are more difficult and verified in person vs. an online auction where a bid retraction can be automated. i.e. you just select a reason from a drop down menu.