Blue Smoke

[QB93Z]

Try connecting a fuel pressure gauge to the passenger side fuel rail. Use a gauge with a long hose so you can tape it to the windshield to view it while driving. At full throttle, the pressure should not drop.

Jim

[FULLPWR]

Originally Posted by QB93Z

Try connecting a fuel pressure gauge to the passenger side fuel rail. Use a gauge with a long hose so you can tape it to the windshield to view it while driving. At full throttle, the pressure should not drop.

Jim

cool i have the pressure gauge but dont have a long hose( well i mean long guage hose you think parts house would have it???

thanks Jim

[scottfab]

Originally Posted by FULLPWR

i just went searching and found something on...egine running...pull primary pump fuse to ck sec pump operation, that should tell me right???

Checking fuel is not a bad place to start but.......
If you don't have full power from the beginning of acceleration then it's more likely to be a stuck secondary actuator. (one side or the other or both). I say that because even if the second fuel pump is dead you'll have enough fuel pressure initially to pull full power for a short time then it'll back off.
If the actuator or actuators are not opening up all the way then there
is you problem. Since you'll be under there use some vacuum source directly on the actuators to see it they pull ok. Does the aux air pump run continuously? Is that line from it up to the plenum disconnected?

This may be obvious but I'll state it.
Do make sure you feel some sort of difference when you accelerate say in second and turn the key on. The keys switch on a 90 can become intermittent. The Full Power light should stay on all the time.

[tomtom72]

Jeeze louise, you ain't having any good luck lately Luis!

Okay, here is my take on electric fuel pumps.....I should add that my take is bases upon no actual concrete knowledge at all...

My pumps checked out okay using the FSM test KOEO. They were in the middle to slightly upper end of the allowable ranges, not to the top limits, but close. I figured, "cool, no need for pumps!"

Then I get in on a buy for the whole assembly from the partsladie. I throw the stuff in my stock pile and wait for the day they quit. Then a wild hair gets up my rear, 20 yr old pumps!?! I have the parts, lets do this. I do it and I also pay attention to another brother's bad experience with the actual pumps that are mounted in the thing. His failed in short order so I do his idea & get Bosch pumps. Now I'm going to really, really do this! Boy oh boy! I swap the whole assembly and drive the car, and guess what? It runs better. Stronger at WOT, stronger in 6th on the highway in passing, just plain old stronger....like it was starving for fuel on the secondaries all the time I had the car.

My take on the subject: 20 yr old electric pumps may not have stopped working, but they sure as heck were not working at 100%.

That still leaves #4 hole's issue, which I think is the injector. You checked for spark on that hole by laying the wire with a plug in it to watch the spark, right? I mean we did establish that the spark to #4 was okay to go, right? Then it's got to be the injector, barring any mechanical issue like valves or rings....which it don't seem too likely to be.

:cheers
Tom

Bosch pump P/N: 69225 Not our pump by application. If I find the thread I'll post a link here so you can read up on the issue. It's simple to make them fit in the holders of our tank assembly though.

http://www.zr1.net/forum/showthread....sch+fuel+pumps

[FULLPWR]

Originally Posted by scottfab

Checking fuel is not a bad place to start but.......
If you don't have full power from the beginning of acceleration then it's more likely to be a stuck secondary actuator. (one side or the other or both). I say that because even if the second fuel pump is dead you'll have enough fuel pressure initially to pull full power for a short time then it'll back off.
If the actuator or actuators are not opening up all the way then there
is you problem. Since you'll be under there use some vacuum source directly on the actuators to see it they pull ok. Does the aux air pump run continuously? Is that line from it up to the plenum disconnected?
the aux air pump runs few seconds shuts down and holds good. the line is connected and after it runs and stops it holds then i pulled it out and immediately the hose end going under plenum releases the vac. when i plug back the pump runs and stops holds forever !!

This may be obvious but I'll state it.
Do make sure you feel some sort of difference when you accelerate say in second and turn the key on. The keys switch on a 90 can become intermittent. The Full Power light should stay on all the time.

yes there is a difference thats whats so weird..... and I just was under the plenum to replace the actuators and coils and did all the vac tests.
doesnt mean something changed though gonna find out tonite.

Luis

[FULLPWR]

Originally Posted by tomtom72

Jeeze louise, you ain't having any good luck lately Luis!

Okay, here is my take on electric fuel pumps.....I should add that my take is bases upon no actual concrete knowledge at all...

My pumps checked out okay using the FSM test KOEO. They were in the middle to slightly upper end of the allowable ranges, not to the top limits, but close. I figured, "cool, no need for pumps!"

Then I get in on a buy for the whole assembly from the partsladie. I throw the stuff in my stock pile and wait for the day they quit. Then a wild hair gets up my rear, 20 yr old pumps!?! I have the parts, lets do this. I do it and I also pay attention to another brother's bad experience with the actual pumps that are mounted in the thing. His failed in short order so I do his idea & get Bosch pumps. Now I'm going to really, really do this! Boy oh boy! I swap the whole assembly and drive the car, and guess what? It runs better. Stronger at WOT, stronger in 6th on the highway in passing, just plain old stronger....like it was starving for fuel on the secondaries all the time I had the car.

My take on the subject: 20 yr old electric pumps may not have stopped working, but they sure as heck were not working at 100%.

That still leaves #4 hole's issue, which I think is the injector. You checked for spark on that hole by laying the wire with a plug in it to watch the spark, right? I mean we did establish that the spark to #4 was okay to go, right? Then it's got to be the injector, barring any mechanical issue like valves or rings....which it don't seem too likely to be.

:cheers
Tom

Bosch pump P/N: 69225 Not our pump by application. If I find the thread I'll post a link here so you can read up on the issue. It's simple to make them fit in the holders of our tank assembly though.

http://www.zr1.net/forum/showthread....sch+fuel+pumps

Tom I bought the same assembly from partsladi last year and I too put it up in garage LOL Very much apprieciate this info you just posted, I will do the same to mine. maybe not just yet though... lol

Yes i bought that plug wire tester thing you told me about and did it with that in fact did them all too. and they were brightly lit and consistant.



.... Rick just hooked me up with a Alternator for tonite.
will post what we find under the plenum tonite.

......going four directions at once...... whooohoooo !!!

[tomtom72]

Originally Posted by FULLPWR

Tom I bought the same assembly from partsladi last year and I too put it up in garage LOL Very much apprieciate this info you just posted, I will do the same to mine. maybe not just yet though... lol

Yes i bought that plug wire tester thing you told me about and did it with that in fact did them all too. and they were brightly lit and consistant.



.... Rick just hooked me up with a starter for tonite.
will post what we find under the plenum tonite.

......going four directions at once...... whooohoooo !!!

Good luck tonight Luis!


Tom

[rhipsher]

Yes I drove Luises car yesterday evening and somethings definetly wrong. I could smell the exhaust fumes when he pulled up. It feels like the power key is off and it should have far more get up and go than it does. So I showed Luis how to pull codes with a paper clip (poor mans OBD2 meter). And the only codes that set were 72 and 74 which is electrical. His car only has 30k miles on it. I told Luis it's to bad mine isn't put back together or I'd show you how it should run. When you punch it at 4000 rpm's it should yank your head off. But we will get it figured out. I'm in no hurry to get mine put back together so we will get his running right first.

[USAFPILOT]

think we got it now huh!

[FULLPWR]

First and most important !!

Special to Rick & Ryan for changing directions in a moments notice, when we were supposed to be working on Rick's Z, my Z got jealous and locked up the belt tensioner bearing then slapped the tensioner pulley up tensioner against my alternator pulley fan blades, which bent them so bad in one spot they were chewing the edge of the serpt. belt, causing a screeching bad atlernator bearing sound.
Pulled the plenum, re-tested all the secondary system, Rick suggested changing out the sec port solenoid just for grins, so did it.
Changed the tensioner with new, Rick bent back the alt. fan blades and then no more screeching noise. took it for a drive and that solenoide made a big difference. (dont know why it didnt throw a code though) maybe the ecltrical solenoid was working but just not mechanically opening to let vaccum thru !?!?.....but.......on way home battery light started flashing and losing headlights, dash lights ect...didnt seem to run too good needed some current i guess.
The alternator was hit so hard it messed something up inside.
Next day Rick came over to my house for another plenum pull and alternator change out..... Got er Done !!!!
Now it very different maybe not perfect but definitely pulls a whole lot better!!!!


To Summarize:

I wanted the conclusion of this thread to be a answer to and fix of the "Blue Smoke", but I have really never figured out the Blue Smoke entirely. I think it was a combination of things. when it was the worst is when i had a bad coil and semi-clogged pvc's,vac leak, and maybe bad gas.
Starting to believe it wasnt a TRUE BLUE smoke more of a rich fuel issue like Tom said.

As of Today:

She runs great, puffs a lil smoke on start-up, no ses lights, all seems fine.

To Do:

We all still think Tom is right about getting the Injectors ck'd out.
So now i can make a decision on the exhaust then get her to Corey's for injector stuff and tuning.


But............. last nite on way home I hear from the rear Tick..Tick...Tick... squeak.....squeak.... squeak.....half shaft U-Joints want some dam attention now.......

Big Sincere Thanks to all that have posted and gave me so much helpful info and allowed me to bounce off my crazy questions and ideas.
Rick and Ryan for proving that the brotherhood of the Z is real and alive.



Luis