CCM issue - no start - ZR-1 Net Registry Forums

65ZR1 · 10-06-2010

Ive been working away wiring up my car so I can finally fire it up. I cant wait to hear the sound of an LT5 through 3 inch side pipes! I have a proplem with the CCM though. First some background details.

Ive installed a 94 LT5 with a custom wiring harness. The chip is from Haibeck and is supposed to have the VATS removed. I am also running the 94 CCM and the main dash harness since I want to run the digital dash. Looks great in the 65 dash! I have removed the ABS/ASR, the DERM, the PKE systems and all the associated wiring.

The car and dash powers up fine. The security light is not on but the starter will not crank. The clutch switch and all power connections are fine. The CCM will not ground the solenoid relay under the dash. I have verified all this with a VOA meter.

When I enter the the CCM diagnostic mode and go to 1.4 to cycle the outputs I can get the relay to operate and the starter then cranks. Leave the diagnostic mode and it wont crank. I have manually ( because these switches are not hooked up yet) disarmed the UTD by cycling a door lock switch input and cycled a key in ignition input but still nothing happens.

Is there something I am missing?? Even though the VATS is removed from the ECM do you have to bypass the starter relay? Does removing the VATS from the ECM automatically remove it from the CCM so that chip in the key is no longer needed? Any help would be appreciated!

Kris

-=Jeff=- · 10-06-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by 65ZR1

Ive been working away wiring up my car so I can finally fire it up. I cant wait to hear the sound of an LT5 through 3 inch side pipes! I have a proplem with the CCM though. First some background details.

Ive installed a 94 LT5 with a custom wiring harness. The chip is from Haibeck and is supposed to have the VATS removed. I am also running the 94 CCM and the main dash harness since I want to run the digital dash. Looks great in the 65 dash! I have removed the ABS/ASR, the DERM, the PKE systems and all the associated wiring.

The car and dash powers up fine. The security light is not on but the starter will not crank. The clutch switch and all power connections are fine. The CCM will not ground the solenoid relay under the dash. I have verified all this with a VOA meter.

When I enter the the CCM diagnostic mode and go to 1.4 to cycle the outputs I can get the relay to operate and the starter then cranks. Leave the diagnostic mode and it wont crank. I have manually ( because these switches are not hooked up yet) disarmed the UTD by cycling a door lock switch input and cycled a key in ignition input but still nothing happens.

Is there something I am missing?? Even though the VATS is removed from the ECM do you have to bypass the starter relay? Does removing the VATS from the ECM automatically remove it from the CCM so that chip in the key is no longer needed? Any help would be appreciated!

Kris

Kris,

I don't think bypassing the ECM VATS flag will bypass the CCM VATS. Do you know the key code for the CCM you have? if so you could make a resistor network to always fool the CCM to assume you have VATS working.

What are the pins for the Solenoid off of the CCM, Also did you jump the 2 bigger red (I think) wires that would go to the DERM? if not the ECM will not receive power

Tyler Townsley · 10-06-2010

A work around is to run a wire to the hot side of the starter and make it long enough to reach the plus side of the battery. When faced with a no start you can use that to turn the starter over. If it is a ccm problem the car will start and run. I have a problem on my 88 that comes up if I do not start it over a period of time. I have the clutch switch bypassed and ecm flaged to ignore the VATs but it sometimes has to be started using the direct wire method. If this works you could rewire the ignition switch to start using this approach.

Tyler

65ZR1 · 10-07-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by -=Jeff=-

Kris,

I don't think bypassing the ECM VATS flag will bypass the CCM VATS. Do you know the key code for the CCM you have? if so you could make a resistor network to always fool the CCM to assume you have VATS working.

What are the pins for the Solenoid off of the CCM, Also did you jump the 2 bigger red (I think) wires that would go to the DERM? if not the ECM will not receive power

I think I will phone Haibeck to confirm the VATS. The manual does state that in order to cycle the relay in diagnostic mode a proper key pellet must be used. I can cycle the relay so I think this is OK.

All power is present and the CCM is not putting up an error code except for a 73 which is for the LCD dimming. I just have the feeling that I am missing something. I will keep trying!

65ZR1 · 10-07-2010

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyler Townsley

A work around is to run a wire to the hot side of the starter and make it long enough to reach the plus side of the battery. When faced with a no start you can use that to turn the starter over. If it is a ccm problem the car will start and run. I have a problem on my 88 that comes up if I do not start it over a period of time. I have the clutch switch bypassed and ecm flaged to ignore the VATs but it sometimes has to be started using the direct wire method. If this works you could rewire the ignition switch to start using this approach.

Tyler

Thanks for the reply Tyler. I could bypass the relay and if I dont figure this out I will. Its just one of those puzzles I would like to solve. Do you know if removing the VATS from the ECM removes it from the CCM too?

65ZR1 · 10-07-2010

Just got off the phone with Haibeck. The VATS is programmed out of the ECM so fuel is always enabled. However, this doesnt effect the CCM for cranking. Either bypass the relay or splice a resistor in. Relay sounds easier but putting a resistor in with a hidden switch would still provide some theft protection.

-=Jeff=- · 10-07-2010

Resistor to the CCM is easy, assuming you can get to the 2 pins and you know the VATS code to make a resistor for it.

phrogs · 10-08-2010

you have 15 trys to figure out what it is unless you have the history of the CCM you have like the key or can find out what it was.

but it shouldn't be to hard to bypass it.

tf95ZR1 · 10-08-2010

I'm no expert and this may be stupid, but after doing a lot of work on my LT5 engine and putting it back together it wouldn't turn over. I had forgotten that you have to depress the clutch while turning the key. Maybe..........?

10-06-2010	#1
65ZR1 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 139	CCM issue - no start Ive been working away wiring up my car so I can finally fire it up. I cant wait to hear the sound of an LT5 through 3 inch side pipes! I have a proplem with the CCM though. First some background details. Ive installed a 94 LT5 with a custom wiring harness. The chip is from Haibeck and is supposed to have the VATS removed. I am also running the 94 CCM and the main dash harness since I want to run the digital dash. Looks great in the 65 dash! I have removed the ABS/ASR, the DERM, the PKE systems and all the associated wiring. The car and dash powers up fine. The security light is not on but the starter will not crank. The clutch switch and all power connections are fine. The CCM will not ground the solenoid relay under the dash. I have verified all this with a VOA meter. When I enter the the CCM diagnostic mode and go to 1.4 to cycle the outputs I can get the relay to operate and the starter then cranks. Leave the diagnostic mode and it wont crank. I have manually ( because these switches are not hooked up yet) disarmed the UTD by cycling a door lock switch input and cycled a key in ignition input but still nothing happens. Is there something I am missing?? Even though the VATS is removed from the ECM do you have to bypass the starter relay? Does removing the VATS from the ECM automatically remove it from the CCM so that chip in the key is no longer needed? Any help would be appreciated! Kris

10-06-2010	#3
Tyler Townsley Join Date: May 2005 Location: Nichols, FL Posts: 615	Re: CCM issue - no start A work around is to run a wire to the hot side of the starter and make it long enough to reach the plus side of the battery. When faced with a no start you can use that to turn the starter over. If it is a ccm problem the car will start and run. I have a problem on my 88 that comes up if I do not start it over a period of time. I have the clutch switch bypassed and ecm flaged to ignore the VATs but it sometimes has to be started using the direct wire method. If this works you could rewire the ignition switch to start using this approach. Tyler __________________ 55 Polo White (Project) 61 Jewel Blue (Sold to buy above) 66 Nassau Blue 68 Torch Red 88 ZR1 Blue 90 ZR1 White

10-07-2010	#6
65ZR1 Join Date: May 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 139	Re: CCM issue - no start Just got off the phone with Haibeck. The VATS is programmed out of the ECM so fuel is always enabled. However, this doesnt effect the CCM for cranking. Either bypass the relay or splice a resistor in. Relay sounds easier but putting a resistor in with a hidden switch would still provide some theft protection.

10-07-2010	#7
-=Jeff=- Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Bartlett, IL Posts: 7,169	Re: CCM issue - no start Resistor to the CCM is easy, assuming you can get to the 2 pins and you know the VATS code to make a resistor for it. __________________ 1990 Corvette ZR-1 #1051 Watson Headers (2" Primary) - Flowmaster Cats - Borla Catback Late Model IH - Plenum Coilovers - 4.10s Custom Interior NCM Lifetime Member #978

10-08-2010	#8
phrogs Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Kalamazoo MI Posts: 1,753	Re: CCM issue - no start you have 15 trys to figure out what it is unless you have the history of the CCM you have like the key or can find out what it was. but it shouldn't be to hard to bypass it. __________________ JOHNNY P Currently own 90 ZR-1 #845 DRM 500 engine package 90 #226 Parts car Hit me up if you need anything.

10-08-2010	#9
tf95ZR1 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Northridge, CA Posts: 1,461	Re: CCM issue - no start I'm no expert and this may be stupid, but after doing a lot of work on my LT5 engine and putting it back together it wouldn't turn over. I had forgotten that you have to depress the clutch while turning the key. Maybe..........?