Tire Balancing?

[Racinfan83]

Another question for Ya'All. Car has a pretty bad vibration over 55mph. Feels like tires out of balance. Took it to one local Chevy dealer here a while back. They balanced tires. Still had vibration. So I took it to another Chevy dealer here last week and had em do it again. Guy said a couple of them were off by 1/2oz. SO - drove it to Chicago and back this weekend and it still shakes like crazy. It's not a harmonic vibration like a loose u-joint or driveshaft would make, and not a side-to-side shaking of the steering wheel either. It is more of an up and down vibration that feels to me like bad tire balance. Tires are Nittos with probably 90% tread - no uneven wear I can see.
Is there a "trick" or special machine required to get these big wheels balanced? I am taking it back to the second dealer (most recent) next Monday to have them redo it. I know on my little Honda daily driver with normal tires - they had to do them 3 friggin times before it was right???

[We Gone]

4 types of balance.
1. static (non spun bubble)
2. single plane (weights on one side or center)
3. duel plane (most common weights on inside & outside)
4. road force. (most expensive done on a Hunter with pressure on the tire)

[Dynomite]

I got these tires at Discount Tire and they installed the tires on the rims and balanced them perfectly......I have had them over 130 and no vibration. I think my tires were spun up to speed on some type of dynamic balancing machine which was covered for safety.

An outside shot......you could be loosing wheel weights going down the road. But to start with after a good balance you would not feel vibration at any speed.

Discount Tire

FRONT.................................................. ....................REAR
Nitto NT 555 Extreme Performance..................................Nitto NT 555R Drag Radial
P275/40ZR-17 98W.................................................. ...315/35R-17 102V B
.................................................

1. Can you feel if it is front or rear tires/drive train?
2. Jack up the front and see if your wheels feel loose in any way (front wheel bearings).
3. Could be flywheel or clutch...or universal joints in drive shaft.....or U-Joints in short shafts between Differential and rear tires.
4. Or rear wheel bearings (jack up rear and see if rear wheels are loose in any way).
5. I assume the trans is not moving on you in any way (no direct vibration in that area).

6. You might jack up the rear axle and fire it up with a lot of clear space in front. Shift into all gears and see if you have any vibration.
7. Have someone watch the drive train from outside listening for any vibration noise. That would eliminate the front end as the source.
8. Put a hand on all the U-Joints and push side to side looking for play (rotate U-Joint 90 deg and push side to side again).

Then let us know......It could be tire balancing as my Nittos did take a lot of wheel weights but like I say.....Discount Tire installed the tires on my rims and balanced with absolutely NO issues.

When did vibration start? At any time did you NOT have a vibration? Stuff like that may help the guys solve the issues.......

Seems like you got this Z in April 2013.....did it have a vibration from the start?
Did it have the Nittos from the start?

[Racinfan83]

I got it in April and yes it has always had these tires and the vibration. It's hard to tell, just drove 600 miles and was trying to figure it out most of the way, but I think it is worse in the rear. The car only has 18k miles on it - so I guess its possible that it has bearing or driveshaft issues - but I don't really think it's likely. If I get a chance I will check some of these things myself - will definitely check it all when I take it back to dealer. Pretty sure they have stick on weights and they are all right behind the spokes. Tires are Nitto 555 Extremes all 4. My gut says balance issue. I assume the dealers have the state of the art equipment for doing this - but I also know that most of the guys they have do that kind of stuff are the new "grease monkeys" with little experience. Everywhere I have taken this car ( other then Haibecks ) the guys have all been kinda freaked out by the car. Makes me nervous to take it anywhere because I can sense the mechanics are nervous about working on it.... But stuff like this I cant do myself...

[Jagdpanzer]

Had the same problem with a new set of GY D3s. Found a shop with a Hunter road force balancing machine and that solved it. Some say its a little pricey but to me it's the best money you can spend to insure the best results out of a new set of tires.

[jimmy b.]

Originally Posted by Racinfan83

Another question for Ya'All. Car has a pretty bad vibration over 55mph. Feels like tires out of balance. Took it to one local Chevy dealer here a while back. They balanced tires. Still had vibration. So I took it to another Chevy dealer here last week and had em do it again. Guy said a couple of them were off by 1/2oz. SO - drove it to Chicago and back this weekend and it still shakes like crazy. It's not a harmonic vibration like a loose u-joint or driveshaft would make, and not a side-to-side shaking of the steering wheel either. It is more of an up and down vibration that feels to me like bad tire balance. Tires are Nittos with probably 90% tread - no uneven wear I can see.
Is there a "trick" or special machine required to get these big wheels balanced? I am taking it back to the second dealer (most recent) next Monday to have them redo it. I know on my little Honda daily driver with normal tires - they had to do them 3 friggin times before it was right???

Here's the part I don't understand, you had the car at two different dealers and yet neither mechanic was conscientious enough to make sure the vibration was gone before they parked the car. So what did you pay for? Seems to me they could have made more money had they put the effort into determining exactly what is wrong and making additional repairs if that what is needed. I question whether they had a real mechanic do the work or just some young kid instead who basically does oil changes and change tires. Oh and if it was a real mechanic and he probably gets paid flat rate, won't spend any more time than the job at hand pays him. I could spend a week on this "flat rate" topic alone, but that's a thread all by its self at a later time. Now I know there are a lot of great mechanics and I'm not bashing ya's but it pisses me off when some one who can actually afford to take their car to a dealer that they should have the best trained professional hopefully certified people work on their car and they end up with letting crap like this out the door. I put most of the blame mostly on management and the almighty dollar. Ok I'm done ranting but if I was the mechanic and I couldn't get the vibration out I wouldn't be able to sleep till I figured it out thats just me I'm a nut case anyway. Sorry to be so long with this. Back to the case at hand.

If the vibration is felt in the steering wheel only along with the wheels check all front suspension components including the rack assembly for wear.

If you feel the vibration in the seat of you pants check along with the wheels all the drive line, rear suspension components for wear.

A simple easy check to do is jack up each wheel separately (one at a time) just high enough to spin the tire freely and get directly behind or in front depending on front or back and just look at the tire and see if 1 if the tread is running true, 2 the bottom of the tire is running true and square and 3 if the rim and or axle is bent. If any of these wobble or don't run true while you or some one else is spinning the tire this could be part or all of your problem. Could be something as stupid as the tread or an internal belt that has separated or some damage. If there's any type of wobble you'll see it.

just remember one wheel at a time and spin tire by hand... on the rear you probably have to jack both wheels cause the posi rear won't let you spin one tire by, it self with the other on the ground. Just safeguard and block the front wheels ... hope this helps and sorry again about the long post.

jimmy

[Dynomite]

Jimmy........I am with you. If it is still vibrating, spin it around go right back and get your money back or get it fixed

[mike100]

I have the same problem on my C6. Stays in balance for a couple of drives and then it all goes bad a week later. At first I considered it to be from infrequent use as the tires might be flat-spotting, but I think sometimes you just get a bad tire...cord separating inside or some kind of defect that allows it to slip on the bead.

maybe you should take a piece of chalk or a wax pencil and mark the rims and tires to see if it slips.

[WVZR-1]

Tires weren't your purchase it seems so you could have issues that aren't correctable with a simple balance or maybe even something that isn't a tire issue. Certainly needs to be considered. Bad tire (construction issue). That needs to be considered for sure. You didn't mention age. There's always the possibility that after considerable miles there's no balance going to correct tires that were run "out of balance" or that weren't true when first mounted. Tires are date coded. How old?

Since you're returning it to the second dealer make notes of weight location and amount using the valve stem as a reference before they start. Mark the tire at the valve stem. If there's an excessive amount of weight used presently have them checked as is BUT before the rebalance ask that the tire be repositioned more appropriately to a better position on the wheel. That's the most frequent step not done by any tire shop and used to be the "first move" by a quality shop. Goodyear used to have a weight maximum and if it exceeded that it was policy that the tire be repositioned and the balance redone or the tire replaced. Wheel problems?

If you asked only that either dealer it's been to that the tires be balanced you likely got what you asked for. If you explained the vibration "at speed" and asked for resolution there needed to be "road tests at speed". Some dealer locations aren't in areas that work well for "road tests" certainly not "at speed". Road test certainly seems to be a requirement here. The comments by "jimmy b." - "Dynomite" seem maybe a little misplaced.

Most dealers now have road force but it's not used for everyday services and balances. Going in maybe it's the responsibility of the owner to either request it or ask what equipment is used. Road force would certainly be the desired because it will certainly find problems with the tire being "true" and will usually indicate construction issues.

Your Honda experience should have maybe been your education!

[Dynomite]

Originally Posted by WVZR-1

The comments by "jimmy b." - "Dynomite" seem maybe a little misplaced.

That would not be the first time for Dynomite........

But...I am sticking with Jimmy on this one (I like his tire spinning analysis)

And....I would think if the tire runs true on the Balancing machine and is in balance......could be something else going on to check in any event.
Always good practice to check the drive train and other suspension components (including the balance of flywheel and clutch) just to make sure something is not coming apart or something was not previously installed wrong (especially in the drive train).

All the comments about tires in these posts are very informative and I appreciate that....learning something new every day here

This car is a bit difficult to analyze since it Came That Way and no one knows the history.

So got to start from scratch.....could be anything....could even be something simple and inexpensive to fix

I guess if it does not vibrate in neutral with engine running (say 1000-3000 rpm) car stopped we can eliminate flywheel and clutch

One down and 30 to go......LOL...that was easy......LOL

Remembering.......... Tires are Nittos with probably 90% tread - no uneven wear I can see.