removing the secondaries a compelling story - Page 4 - ZR-1 Net Registry Forums

GOLDCYLON · 03-27-2012

Ok pics are back up. I should have the car back this weekend.

tomtom72 · 03-27-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOLDCYLON

Ok pics are back up. I should have the car back this weekend.

VetteMed · 03-27-2012

Great News, Daryll!!

GOLDCYLON · 03-28-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by VetteMed

Great News, Daryll!!

Yep I am so..... Ready

Just installed a radiator today on my POPs 96CE and put his new front a rear CE emblems on. Took the day off bonding with tools always fun.

Paul Workman · 03-28-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOLDCYLON

Yes

All heads benefit from porting. The real question does the cost = the potential gain. Your mileage may vary. Mine are being done at a local shop very cheap due to my sons friendship with the owner.

Cost = gain? Yep, that IS the question. AND, education cost $$ too! How does $100+/rwhp sound? That's assuming YOU do the engine pull and reinstallment. - Like I said education ain't free neither!

My heads had to come off anyway, due to a valve problem. (I believe was there when I bought the car, possibly due to a bad injector.) I love the power the porting bought me - I love it - don't get me wrong. BUT, IF you're not racing, 400+ rwhp ain't too shabby at all, and enough to get the attention of all contemporary Vettes except the "Zs"...NOT too shabby at all for a little DIY plenum and IH porting + exhaust system! And, my biggest "seat of the pants" boost came at that point; a 60+rwhp lift for porting the plenum and IHs and installing the exhaust. The additional 26-30 for the heads was just the cherry on top, but the BIG bucks was in the heads, as the engine has to come out, the porting (not for the fient fo heart) has to be done, the cams timed, gaskets, etc, etc, pressure tested and repaired as needed...

P.

tf95ZR1 · 03-28-2012

Yes, the work to port the heads is labor intensive
and therefore either $$$ and/or a PITA. But,
If I read the thread correctly, the question was
is it worth it to open up (port) the Throttle Body?
See post #23.
That's another issue. Waiting for opinions........

Then see post #26. I think Marc H. was mis-quoted.
He probably said there wasn't much gain porting the
throttle body, but porting the heads is beneficial.

GOLDCYLON · 03-28-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by tf95ZR1

Yes, the work to port the heads is labor intensive
and therefore either $$$ and/or a PITA. But,
If I read the thread correctly, the question was
is it worth it to open up (port) the Throttle Body?
See post #23.
That's another issue. Waiting for opinions........

Then see post #26. I think Marc H. was mis-quoted.
He probably said there wasn't much gain porting the
throttle body, but porting the heads is beneficial.

From all the folks I talked to the short answer was no not really. Possible gain if you are going the stroker route but if just top end porting with no stroker action below no was the uninamious response. I went with no reguardless It wasnt worth it to me unless there was significant gain.

Paul Workman · 03-29-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOLDCYLON

Frank a thought just occured to me. Should I increase the porting to the TB say 63MM. Help me oh racing obiwan.

I recently had this conversation with Marc. If I recall correctly, he felt the 63mm TB was worth ≈ 6 or possibly 8 hp, ± on a stock block.

I was thinking it would make more difference than that. The fully ported top end increases area of the runners by approx 19%. Coincidently, increasing the TB from 58 to 63 mm is also approx 19%.

Well, physics is an interesting study, in that flow and pressure and resistance, are terms that can be translated into electrical properties; i.e., Amperes, volts, resistance...for example.

Curious what would happen in electronics if a similar model were built, I set up a series circuit with two resistors; one representing the TB, and the other representing the rest of the ported top end. And, for a benchmark, I used the power gain of my motor having been fully ported except for the stock TB. Then I reduced the resistance value of the TB by 19% to see what the difference in power would be. Coincidently(?)...the answer was 6 hp!!!

I'm not drawing any hard won conclusions, but it was a bit of a surprise, if nothing else... Sure would like to have a dyno day and a pair of TBs; one stock and one ported and swap 'em back and forth a few times to see.

Just a thought.

P.

GOLDCYLON · 03-29-2012

Wow Paul you are the only one I am aware off that has put a hp figure to it

mike100 · 03-29-2012

That's a pretty cool ratio calculation- the next question is that if it does anything under the curve before 6000 rpms and if you have stock exhaust manifolds, for instance, will that bottleneck negate any further intake gains.

I guess the tb enlargement might still be left for last- or maybe at the same time you port the heads.

03-27-2012	#31
GOLDCYLON Join Date: May 2007 Location: Peoria, AZ Posts: 9,155	Re: removing the secondaries a compelling story Ok pics are back up. I should have the car back this weekend. __________________ GOLDCYLON - 91 ZR-1 #2014 GOLDCYLON - 90 ZR-1 #2794, 4L60e (Formerly Schrade's) GOLDCYLON - 11 CTS-V Arizona State Director 91 WHITE/BLACK #2014. 380 P&P&PCed,Ported Heads, Jeal Long tubes, Corsa Exhaust/FIKSE FM-5s /LED TLs, LED Headlights, Front Wilwood 6 piston narrowlite calipers and rear Wilwood caliper street shop mod,CNCed Coolant Pipes,TPI Cvr,Filter cover,Stainless Bolts, DRM/DOM PROM /ZFDOC mod build #102,DRLs,BMAD with stainless Debris Screen,Coplan Air Blaster, Pioneer APP Radio 4,Brey-Krause HB,Sub Bar,Fire extinguisher seat mount,DRM Coilovers,LEDs everywhere,Compass mirror (orange),V1 DIC hidden display, Homelink sun visor, Carbon Fiber top x3 and APSIS Carbon Fiber interior, APSIS CF Steering Wheel/NAPA Leather, Banski trailing arms, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension) ZFDoc drive shaft safety loop, raptor shift light (orange),AO engineering louver front plate, Console seat cushion, 96CE seats with black custom Sheepskins, ss billet catch can,Viper remote entry/alarm,Cragar Rear Louvers,LED side louver lights, Dewitts Radiator with SPAL fans and a Woods 160 T-Stat 90 RED/BLACK #2794. 4L60e Automatic Stage V by RPM Transmission, TCI Dedicated TCM, OBX Stainless Headers, Corsa Exhaust, SAN Secondaries and Haibeck PROM, Exotic Muscle Coil overs, LED Interior Lights, LED Tail Lights, LED Headlights, 94 Sport seats with black custom Sheepskins , Cragar rear louvers, GS Front calipers, Banski Trailing arms, APSIS Carbon Fiber steering wheel, Front and Rear Baer Eradispeeds, DRLs, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension), Dewitt's Raditor with Dual SPAL fans and a Haibeck 170 T-Stat 11 RED/GREY CTS-V

03-27-2012	#33
VetteMed Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Orlando, FL Posts: 1,828	Re: removing the secondaries a compelling story Great News, Daryll!! __________________ 2004 Z06/Z16 LeMans Commemorative Edition 1991 ZR-1 #302 White/Gray (sold) 1991 ZR-1 #1147 Red/Saddle (sold)

03-28-2012	#36
tf95ZR1 Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Northridge, CA Posts: 1,461	Re: removing the secondaries a compelling story Yes, the work to port the heads is labor intensive and therefore either $$$ and/or a PITA. But, If I read the thread correctly, the question was is it worth it to open up (port) the Throttle Body? See post #23. That's another issue. Waiting for opinions........ Then see post #26. I think Marc H. was mis-quoted. He probably said there wasn't much gain porting the throttle body, but porting the heads is beneficial. Last edited by tf95ZR1; 03-28-2012 at 03:20 PM. Reason: Wanted 2

03-29-2012	#39
GOLDCYLON Join Date: May 2007 Location: Peoria, AZ Posts: 9,155	Re: removing the secondaries a compelling story Wow Paul you are the only one I am aware off that has put a hp figure to it __________________ GOLDCYLON - 91 ZR-1 #2014 GOLDCYLON - 90 ZR-1 #2794, 4L60e (Formerly Schrade's) GOLDCYLON - 11 CTS-V Arizona State Director 91 WHITE/BLACK #2014. 380 P&P&PCed,Ported Heads, Jeal Long tubes, Corsa Exhaust/FIKSE FM-5s /LED TLs, LED Headlights, Front Wilwood 6 piston narrowlite calipers and rear Wilwood caliper street shop mod,CNCed Coolant Pipes,TPI Cvr,Filter cover,Stainless Bolts, DRM/DOM PROM /ZFDOC mod build #102,DRLs,BMAD with stainless Debris Screen,Coplan Air Blaster, Pioneer APP Radio 4,Brey-Krause HB,Sub Bar,Fire extinguisher seat mount,DRM Coilovers,LEDs everywhere,Compass mirror (orange),V1 DIC hidden display, Homelink sun visor, Carbon Fiber top x3 and APSIS Carbon Fiber interior, APSIS CF Steering Wheel/NAPA Leather, Banski trailing arms, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension) ZFDoc drive shaft safety loop, raptor shift light (orange),AO engineering louver front plate, Console seat cushion, 96CE seats with black custom Sheepskins, ss billet catch can,Viper remote entry/alarm,Cragar Rear Louvers,LED side louver lights, Dewitts Radiator with SPAL fans and a Woods 160 T-Stat 90 RED/BLACK #2794. 4L60e Automatic Stage V by RPM Transmission, TCI Dedicated TCM, OBX Stainless Headers, Corsa Exhaust, SAN Secondaries and Haibeck PROM, Exotic Muscle Coil overs, LED Interior Lights, LED Tail Lights, LED Headlights, 94 Sport seats with black custom Sheepskins , Cragar rear louvers, GS Front calipers, Banski Trailing arms, APSIS Carbon Fiber steering wheel, Front and Rear Baer Eradispeeds, DRLs, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension), Dewitt's Raditor with Dual SPAL fans and a Haibeck 170 T-Stat 11 RED/GREY CTS-V

03-29-2012	#40
mike100 Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: San Marcos CA Posts: 1,802	Re: removing the secondaries a compelling story That's a pretty cool ratio calculation- the next question is that if it does anything under the curve before 6000 rpms and if you have stock exhaust manifolds, for instance, will that bottleneck negate any further intake gains. I guess the tb enlargement might still be left for last- or maybe at the same time you port the heads.