gearbox/transmission noise - ZR-1 Net Registry Forums

8cam · 10-28-2013

With my screaming water pump fixed, now I can hear all the other stuff going on. FYI my car sat for 15 years which is never good for rotating surfaces, so I'm prepared for whatever might be happening. I hope.

I have two distinct noises going on. The first one sounds like a bearing noise. Symptoms are a rotating/rattling sound with the clutch engaged (pedal out), trans in neutral. When I disengage the clutch the noise goes away, which tells me it's on the transmission side. Hoping this isn't something too ugly.

The second noise is gear whine, and it's pretty damn loud. Happens in at least the first three gears, noisiest in 1st and 2nd. It might happen in 4th too, but it's a lot quieter then and I'm going fast enough that road noise takes over. This noise goes on when idling along with no throttle, under acceleration and off throttle, up and down with the speed of the car. Definitely gear whine. I'm going to bet the oil hasn't been changed in a LONG time, so it's on the list. I see some posts about Castrol TWS. I also know the Ferrari guys swear by Red Line shockproof oils, which have similar characteristics to motor oils with some interesting additives. Only limitations are they can't be used in pump/filter situations. What's the latest recommendation?

Kevin · 10-28-2013

sounds like it could be normal black tag whine. the early trannies are known as "rock crushers" due to the way the gears are cut. Most replace the factory fluid with bmw fluid

mike100 · 10-28-2013

perfectly normal as you described it. pedal in quiets down on the ZF. If the throw-out bearing was bad, it would make more noise, not less, so the noise in in the trans. The amount of whine various from one gearbox to another, but I have seen some perfectly fine units make a lot of noise.

cvette98pacecar · 10-28-2013

Didnt you just pick up this car?

cvette98pacecar · 10-28-2013

Your noises might be normal.
If you have a fidanza lightweight flywheel they sound like a spun bearing when the clutch is engaged in neutral. As for the rear end if you have a 4.09 they scream like a scalded pig.

xlr8nflorida · 10-28-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by cvette98pacecar

Your noises might be normal.
If you have a fidanza lightweight flywheel they sound like a spun bearing when the clutch is engaged in neutral. As for the rear end if you have a 4.09 they scream like a scalded pig.

A 409 rear should not be loud if they are the Viper gears and installed properly.

8cam · 10-28-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by cvette98pacecar

Didnt you just pick up this car?

Yep, had it just over two weeks. I haven't heard gear noise like this since my grandfather's old Biscayne with 3 on the tree. Boy that car met an ignominious end.

I can just about guarantee this car is 100% stock, flywheel, trans and rear end, given the ownership history. But sitting for as long as it did is never good for moving parts and I suspect is a big reason it's so loud. If this kind of noise is really normal, I'll be very surprised. Driving in the parking deck felt like it was echoing off the walls.

I'm thinking a fluid change is seriously overdue and might fix a lot of the issue. Any opinions on the Red Line oils? I may give the guru a call and see what he thinks.

xlr8nflorida · 10-28-2013

Mobil 1 synthetic 75/90 gear oil for the rear axle. I'd use 2 small bottles of GM Additive.

I'd use BMW Castrol in the Transmission.

BMW oil 3 Liters TWS 10w60 synthetic oil - Change it every 10-12K miles if you love your ZF-6.

Redline has good products but I'd use the BMW in the Transmission for various reasons which I don't have time to type out right now.

Kevin · 10-28-2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by xlr8nflorida

A 409 rear should not be loud if they are the Viper gears and installed properly.

thought the viper gears were 4.10s

Franke · 10-28-2013

4 cam - Mark, If this car is stock then one of the first things you should consider is the injectors. If original they don't like ethanol fuels and eventually start shorting the coils. I had 4 bad ones and they were a great part of my tranny noise due to some misfire. When I replaced them I was surprised at how much quieter my trans noise was. I have 56K miles on it now. I use redline MTL in the trans and it seemed to shift a little smoother but that could be due to new fluid more than anything else. I would change all the fluids since you could have water vapor contamination due to the years of sitting. Then if the loud gear whine doesn't subside I would pull the box for a look see inside.

10-28-2013	#1
8cam Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Atlanta Posts: 451	gearbox/transmission noise With my screaming water pump fixed, now I can hear all the other stuff going on. FYI my car sat for 15 years which is never good for rotating surfaces, so I'm prepared for whatever might be happening. I hope. I have two distinct noises going on. The first one sounds like a bearing noise. Symptoms are a rotating/rattling sound with the clutch engaged (pedal out), trans in neutral. When I disengage the clutch the noise goes away, which tells me it's on the transmission side. Hoping this isn't something too ugly. The second noise is gear whine, and it's pretty damn loud. Happens in at least the first three gears, noisiest in 1st and 2nd. It might happen in 4th too, but it's a lot quieter then and I'm going fast enough that road noise takes over. This noise goes on when idling along with no throttle, under acceleration and off throttle, up and down with the speed of the car. Definitely gear whine. I'm going to bet the oil hasn't been changed in a LONG time, so it's on the list. I see some posts about Castrol TWS. I also know the Ferrari guys swear by Red Line shockproof oils, which have similar characteristics to motor oils with some interesting additives. Only limitations are they can't be used in pump/filter situations. What's the latest recommendation? __________________ Mark '90 ZR-1 #1322 Daily Driver, 64k and counting Black/Gray [IMG]http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb49/mlitherland/IMG_0326_zps3d50d8cb.jpg[/IMG]

10-28-2013	#2
Kevin Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: pittsburgh Posts: 4,633	Re: gearbox/transmission noise sounds like it could be normal black tag whine. the early trannies are known as "rock crushers" due to the way the gears are cut. Most replace the factory fluid with bmw fluid __________________ It's not the car, it's the people - Doug Johnson 90 r/r "KEYS ON" nick named "T.L.B"

10-28-2013	#3
mike100 Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: San Marcos CA Posts: 1,802	Re: gearbox/transmission noise perfectly normal as you described it. pedal in quiets down on the ZF. If the throw-out bearing was bad, it would make more noise, not less, so the noise in in the trans. The amount of whine various from one gearbox to another, but I have seen some perfectly fine units make a lot of noise.

10-28-2013	#4
cvette98pacecar Join Date: May 2011 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 2,479	Re: gearbox/transmission noise Didnt you just pick up this car? __________________ Robert J. DeMarco [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] [COLOR=blue]G[/COLOR][COLOR=red]rand[/COLOR] [COLOR=blue]S[/COLOR][COLOR=red]port[/COLOR] Registry Lifetime Member NCM Lifetime Member #2655 Pacecar Registry Member [COLOR=red]ZOOM Charter Member - ZR-1 Owners of Michigan[/COLOR] [COLOR=plum][I]ZR-1[/I] Registry member since 2012 [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]1990 LPE "368" Aerobody ZR-1, Last ZR-1 built by John[/COLOR] 1991 Callaway Aerobody ZR-1, DRM 500 1991 Shinoda Aerobody Spyder, 1998 Pace Car

10-28-2013	#5
cvette98pacecar Join Date: May 2011 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 2,479	Re: gearbox/transmission noise Your noises might be normal. If you have a fidanza lightweight flywheel they sound like a spun bearing when the clutch is engaged in neutral. As for the rear end if you have a 4.09 they scream like a scalded pig. __________________ Robert J. DeMarco [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] [COLOR=blue]G[/COLOR][COLOR=red]rand[/COLOR] [COLOR=blue]S[/COLOR][COLOR=red]port[/COLOR] Registry Lifetime Member NCM Lifetime Member #2655 Pacecar Registry Member [COLOR=red]ZOOM Charter Member - ZR-1 Owners of Michigan[/COLOR] [COLOR=plum][I]ZR-1[/I] Registry member since 2012 [/COLOR] [COLOR=black]1990 LPE "368" Aerobody ZR-1, Last ZR-1 built by John[/COLOR] 1991 Callaway Aerobody ZR-1, DRM 500 1991 Shinoda Aerobody Spyder, 1998 Pace Car

10-28-2013	#8
xlr8nflorida Join Date: May 2008 Location: USA Posts: 1,096	Re: gearbox/transmission noise Mobil 1 synthetic 75/90 gear oil for the rear axle. I'd use 2 small bottles of GM Additive. I'd use BMW Castrol in the Transmission. BMW oil 3 Liters TWS 10w60 synthetic oil - Change it every 10-12K miles if you love your ZF-6. Redline has good products but I'd use the BMW in the Transmission for various reasons which I don't have time to type out right now.

10-28-2013	#10
Franke Join Date: May 2013 Location: Beaver, PA Posts: 516	Re: gearbox/transmission noise 4 cam - Mark, If this car is stock then one of the first things you should consider is the injectors. If original they don't like ethanol fuels and eventually start shorting the coils. I had 4 bad ones and they were a great part of my tranny noise due to some misfire. When I replaced them I was surprised at how much quieter my trans noise was. I have 56K miles on it now. I use redline MTL in the trans and it seemed to shift a little smoother but that could be due to new fluid more than anything else. I would change all the fluids since you could have water vapor contamination due to the years of sitting. Then if the loud gear whine doesn't subside I would pull the box for a look see inside.