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Old 08-14-2022   #1
jrd1990zr1
 
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Default Brake petal goes low intermittently

Took my 1990 out today, was running great. After about a half hour of driving when coming to a light to stop, petal went way down before the brakes engaged. Brake light on for a short time. Petal felt strange. Brakes seemed to work after that but then it happened again after about 6 or so more stops. Fluid in the two reservoirs are where they should be.

Any thoughts on what may be causing this?

Thanks in advance.
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1968 convertible Lemans Blue,
1986 coupe Medium Blue NCRS Top Flight (sold),
1990 ZR1 #2529 Red NCRS Regional and National Top Flight (sold),
1990 ZR1 #2124 Charcoal Metallic NCRS Top Flight 2010 & 2018,
2003 Anniversary Red Convertible (sold)
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Old 08-15-2022   #2
GOLDCYLON
 
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Default Re: Brake petal goes low intermittently

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrd1990zr1 View Post
Took my 1990 out today, was running great. After about a half hour of driving when coming to a light to stop, petal went way down before the brakes engaged. Brake light on for a short time. Petal felt strange. Brakes seemed to work after that but then it happened again after about 6 or so more stops. Fluid in the two reservoirs are where they should be.

Any thoughts on what may be causing this?

Thanks in advance.
Maybe a Compromised brake booster? Open the hood. With the car running have somebody push the brake a couple of times and hear if you have any vacuum noise Coming from the booster area
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GOLDCYLON - 90 ZR-1 #2794, 4L60e (Formerly Schrade's)

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91 WHITE/BLACK #2014. 380 P&P&PCed,Ported Heads, Jeal Long tubes, Corsa Exhaust/FIKSE FM-5s /LED TLs, LED Headlights, Front Wilwood 6 piston narrowlite calipers and rear Wilwood caliper street shop mod,CNCed Coolant Pipes,TPI Cvr,Filter cover,Stainless Bolts, DRM/DOM PROM /ZFDOC mod build #102,DRLs,BMAD with stainless Debris Screen,Coplan Air Blaster, Pioneer APP Radio 4,Brey-Krause HB,Sub Bar,Fire extinguisher seat mount,DRM Coilovers,LEDs everywhere,Compass mirror (orange),V1 DIC hidden display, Homelink sun visor, Carbon Fiber top x3 and APSIS Carbon Fiber interior, APSIS CF Steering Wheel/NAPA Leather, Banski trailing arms, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension) ZFDoc drive shaft safety loop, raptor shift light (orange),AO engineering louver front plate, Console seat cushion, 96CE seats with black custom Sheepskins, ss billet catch can,Viper remote entry/alarm,Cragar Rear Louvers,LED side louver lights, Dewitts Radiator with SPAL fans and a Woods 160 T-Stat

90 RED/BLACK #2794. 4L60e Automatic Stage V by RPM Transmission, TCI Dedicated TCM, OBX Stainless Headers, Corsa Exhaust, SAN Secondaries and Haibeck PROM, Exotic Muscle Coil overs, LED Interior Lights, LED Tail Lights, LED Headlights, 94 Sport seats with black custom Sheepskins , Cragar rear louvers, GS Front calipers, Banski Trailing arms, APSIS Carbon Fiber steering wheel, Front and Rear Baer Eradispeeds, DRLs, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension), Dewitt's Raditor with Dual SPAL fans and a Haibeck 170 T-Stat

11 RED/GREY CTS-V
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Old 08-15-2022   #3
Young1
 
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Default Re: Brake petal goes low intermittently

Install a new master cylinder immediately. Do not drive it anymore.
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Old 08-15-2022   #4
jrd1990zr1
 
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Default Re: Brake petal goes low intermittently

Quote:
Originally Posted by Young1 View Post
Install a new master cylinder immediately. Do not drive it anymore.
Two questions. Why do you think it is the MC rather than the booster? Any idea where you can find a new MC or have this one rebuilt? Rockauto are mostly out of stock.
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1968 convertible Lemans Blue,
1986 coupe Medium Blue NCRS Top Flight (sold),
1990 ZR1 #2529 Red NCRS Regional and National Top Flight (sold),
1990 ZR1 #2124 Charcoal Metallic NCRS Top Flight 2010 & 2018,
2003 Anniversary Red Convertible (sold)
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Old 08-15-2022   #5
jrd1990zr1
 
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Default Re: Brake petal goes low intermittently

Quote:
Originally Posted by GOLDCYLON View Post
Maybe a Compromised brake booster? Open the hood. With the car running have somebody push the brake a couple of times and hear if you have any vacuum noise Coming from the booster area
GC, So if I hear a vacuum noise does that mean the diaphragm is shot in the brake booster? If I don't hear a vacuum noise is it possible it is a bad MC? Do you know of anyone who can rebuild a C4 MC or booster, or a place to buy one?

Thanks.
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1968 convertible Lemans Blue,
1986 coupe Medium Blue NCRS Top Flight (sold),
1990 ZR1 #2529 Red NCRS Regional and National Top Flight (sold),
1990 ZR1 #2124 Charcoal Metallic NCRS Top Flight 2010 & 2018,
2003 Anniversary Red Convertible (sold)
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Old 08-15-2022   #6
GOLDCYLON
 
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Default Re: Brake petal goes low intermittently

Quote:
Originally Posted by jrd1990zr1 View Post
GC, So if I hear a vacuum noise does that mean the diaphragm is shot in the brake booster? If I don't hear a vacuum noise is it possible it is a bad MC? Do you know of anyone who can rebuild a C4 MC or booster, or a place to buy one?

Thanks.
Normally yes and yes

I hope it's the master cylinder as those are easier to find and the 4 bolt vacuum boosters are a bear to find.
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GOLDCYLON - 90 ZR-1 #2794, 4L60e (Formerly Schrade's)

GOLDCYLON - 11 CTS-V


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91 WHITE/BLACK #2014. 380 P&P&PCed,Ported Heads, Jeal Long tubes, Corsa Exhaust/FIKSE FM-5s /LED TLs, LED Headlights, Front Wilwood 6 piston narrowlite calipers and rear Wilwood caliper street shop mod,CNCed Coolant Pipes,TPI Cvr,Filter cover,Stainless Bolts, DRM/DOM PROM /ZFDOC mod build #102,DRLs,BMAD with stainless Debris Screen,Coplan Air Blaster, Pioneer APP Radio 4,Brey-Krause HB,Sub Bar,Fire extinguisher seat mount,DRM Coilovers,LEDs everywhere,Compass mirror (orange),V1 DIC hidden display, Homelink sun visor, Carbon Fiber top x3 and APSIS Carbon Fiber interior, APSIS CF Steering Wheel/NAPA Leather, Banski trailing arms, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension) ZFDoc drive shaft safety loop, raptor shift light (orange),AO engineering louver front plate, Console seat cushion, 96CE seats with black custom Sheepskins, ss billet catch can,Viper remote entry/alarm,Cragar Rear Louvers,LED side louver lights, Dewitts Radiator with SPAL fans and a Woods 160 T-Stat

90 RED/BLACK #2794. 4L60e Automatic Stage V by RPM Transmission, TCI Dedicated TCM, OBX Stainless Headers, Corsa Exhaust, SAN Secondaries and Haibeck PROM, Exotic Muscle Coil overs, LED Interior Lights, LED Tail Lights, LED Headlights, 94 Sport seats with black custom Sheepskins , Cragar rear louvers, GS Front calipers, Banski Trailing arms, APSIS Carbon Fiber steering wheel, Front and Rear Baer Eradispeeds, DRLs, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension), Dewitt's Raditor with Dual SPAL fans and a Haibeck 170 T-Stat

11 RED/GREY CTS-V
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Old 08-17-2022   #7
Young1
 
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Default Re: Brake petal goes low intermittently

Booster is an assist and has nothing to do with the height of the pedal. The pedal went down because fluid escaped past the pistons in the master cylinder. That causes the light to come on. It happened to me once, right before my favorite twisties. O Reillys has a master cylinder for you for under $150.00. Brakes are life and death and thus my abruptness brother.
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1991 ZR-1 Quasar Blue Metallic/Black #729
Second Owner
1991 ZR-1 Dark Red Metallic/Black #2040
SOLD

1990 ZR-1 Dark Red Metallic/Saddle #1670
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Old 08-18-2022   #8
jrd1990zr1
 
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Default Re: Brake petal goes low intermittently

Quote:
Originally Posted by Young1 View Post
Booster is an assist and has nothing to do with the height of the pedal. The pedal went down because fluid escaped past the pistons in the master cylinder. That causes the light to come on. It happened to me once, right before my favorite twisties. O Reillys has a master cylinder for you for under $150.00. Brakes are life and death and thus my abruptness brother.
Steve, I was able to confirm the booster is functioning. Are you aware of a way to 100% verify that it is the MC. I am not questioning your expertise, I don't want to pull it off and have to rebleed the entire system if there is any possibility it could be something else. Looks like the replacement shouldn't be too difficult, 1 electrical connection, two hydraulic lines and a couple bolts. Any other advice would be appreciated. BTW O'Reillys in upstate NY wants $170.00 for the MC. Thanks, John
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1968 convertible Lemans Blue,
1986 coupe Medium Blue NCRS Top Flight (sold),
1990 ZR1 #2529 Red NCRS Regional and National Top Flight (sold),
1990 ZR1 #2124 Charcoal Metallic NCRS Top Flight 2010 & 2018,
2003 Anniversary Red Convertible (sold)
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Old 08-18-2022   #9
conesare2seconds
 
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Default Re: Brake petal goes low intermittently

Tricky part of the MC replacement is the C-clip from the pedal to the rod. You?re upside down with your head in the footwell and it?s dark even with a good light. Be patient, it will work.
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Old 08-18-2022   #10
GOLDCYLON
 
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Default Re: Brake petal goes low intermittently

If the booster is good to go then the master cylinder is the culprit. Looks like you are in good hands advise wise. GC
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GOLDCYLON - 91 ZR-1 #2014
GOLDCYLON - 90 ZR-1 #2794, 4L60e (Formerly Schrade's)

GOLDCYLON - 11 CTS-V


Arizona State Director




91 WHITE/BLACK #2014. 380 P&P&PCed,Ported Heads, Jeal Long tubes, Corsa Exhaust/FIKSE FM-5s /LED TLs, LED Headlights, Front Wilwood 6 piston narrowlite calipers and rear Wilwood caliper street shop mod,CNCed Coolant Pipes,TPI Cvr,Filter cover,Stainless Bolts, DRM/DOM PROM /ZFDOC mod build #102,DRLs,BMAD with stainless Debris Screen,Coplan Air Blaster, Pioneer APP Radio 4,Brey-Krause HB,Sub Bar,Fire extinguisher seat mount,DRM Coilovers,LEDs everywhere,Compass mirror (orange),V1 DIC hidden display, Homelink sun visor, Carbon Fiber top x3 and APSIS Carbon Fiber interior, APSIS CF Steering Wheel/NAPA Leather, Banski trailing arms, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension) ZFDoc drive shaft safety loop, raptor shift light (orange),AO engineering louver front plate, Console seat cushion, 96CE seats with black custom Sheepskins, ss billet catch can,Viper remote entry/alarm,Cragar Rear Louvers,LED side louver lights, Dewitts Radiator with SPAL fans and a Woods 160 T-Stat

90 RED/BLACK #2794. 4L60e Automatic Stage V by RPM Transmission, TCI Dedicated TCM, OBX Stainless Headers, Corsa Exhaust, SAN Secondaries and Haibeck PROM, Exotic Muscle Coil overs, LED Interior Lights, LED Tail Lights, LED Headlights, 94 Sport seats with black custom Sheepskins , Cragar rear louvers, GS Front calipers, Banski Trailing arms, APSIS Carbon Fiber steering wheel, Front and Rear Baer Eradispeeds, DRLs, Guldstrand front suspension,urethane bushings from Prothane (total suspension), Dewitt's Raditor with Dual SPAL fans and a Haibeck 170 T-Stat

11 RED/GREY CTS-V
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