'94 ZR-1 Sold on Cars & Bids in October-commentary

[WARP TEN]

The March issue of Sports Car Market Magazine had an auction comentatry on a ZR-1 sold online. They cover all auctions and do these reviews on all cars they cover. A fair and fairly normal price I would say. Despite the "rising tide" of car and auction prices these days, I am not sure all boats will float to the $60k-$70k level soon. Just my thought.Apologies for the amatuer cut-and-paste on the picture. --Bob

[KJL]

I don't think these cars will ever completely overcome the negative stigma associated with the C4 Corvette not to mention the fact that decent non-ZR1 C4 corvettes are selling for low teens. Of course there will always be motivated buyers out there to be had as long as the seller is willing to wait for one to come along but I think in general these cars will never sell for more than 10 to 15,000 more than a comparable C4 non Z car. Maybe down the road when these cars start to decrease in numbers, their values will finally increase to a level commensurate with what these cars represent.

[WARP TEN]

I don't think these cars will ever completely overcome the negative stigma associated with the C4 Corvette not to mention the fact that decent non-ZR1 C4 corvettes are selling for low teens. Of course there will always be motivated buyers out there to be had as long as the seller is willing to wait for one to come along but I think in general these cars will never sell for more than 10 to 15,000 more than a comparable C4 non Z car. Maybe down the road when these cars start to decrease in numbers, their values will finally increase to a level commensurate with what these cars represent.

On the plus side, by virtue of unfortunately depressed prices on the C4 ZR-1s, many more enthusiasts can afford and enjoy them. I really don't think very many ZR-1 owners bought the cars simply as an investment, although many paid $100,000 for the first '90s. But most of the owners I have known are in it for the fun, the driving experience and the mechanical aspects of the engine and car. . --Bob

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

I don't think these cars will ever completely overcome the negative stigma associated with the C4 Corvette not to mention the fact that decent non-ZR1 C4 corvettes are selling for low teens. Of course there will always be motivated buyers out there to be had as long as the seller is willing to wait for one to come along but I think in general these cars will never sell for more than 10 to 15,000 more than a comparable C4 non Z car. Maybe down the road when these cars start to decrease in numbers, their values will finally increase to a level commensurate with what these cars represent.

:rolleyes:

:cheers:
Marty

[KJL]

On the plus side, by virtue of unfortunately depressed prices on the C4 ZR-1s, many more enthusiasts can afford and enjoy them. I really don't think very many ZR-1 owners bought the cars simply as an investment, although many paid $100,000 for the first '90s. But most of the owners I have known are in it for the fun, the driving experience and the mechanical aspects of the engine and car. . --Bob

Agree. I just love the car and it?s history. I just hope when it is time to pass this car along to next person the car will have at least held its value. I don?t drive them a lot because I want it to continue to feel special every time I do.

[Racinfan83]

There's a 90 Z with 15k miles posted on Facebook Corvette buy sell trade page now. White w red interior, guy says it's 1 of 30. $48k. It looks nice in the pics - but if it gets anywhere near that price I'd be surprised... Mine will go up for sale very quickly...🤔

[spork2367]

:rolleyes:

:cheers:
Marty

You can roll your eyes, but go look at BAT results and it shows exactly this. Clean C4s have gone up in value and comparable low mileage Lt1 and Lt4 cars are right there with ZR-1 closer to a 10k margin, not 15k.

There are lots of different perspectives on this. From the driver, to the collector, to the dealer.

Sure, if I had 6 ZR-1s on my car lot, I'd be hoping that wasn't the case.

They are definitely up over the last 2 years, but the entire market is. Clean low mileage cars are starting to bring much more of a premium over drivers cars than they did previously.

The market is cooling off again though. I think it's more of an overall market trend, because air cooled Porsches have leveled off as well. My sister just sold her clean 80k 1984 911 on BAT. BAT cars still bring a 10% premium over the rest of the market for whatever reason. But then, you can look at the 2000 Chevy Metro that just sold on there for 18k and never cease to be amazed at how people spend their money.

If these cars were going to catch that big break they've missed three opportunities that seemingly could have set the benchmark for an increase in popularity.

- The intro of the C6/C7 ZR1s
- The tsunami of a price increase on 90s cars from NSXs to Porsches, to Vipers, to 308s etc. In the time those cars were doubling in value, the ZR-1 sat still.
- Then the reintroduction of the second ever DOHC Corvette motor.

If none of those boosted the popularity, they probably just are what they are. That combined with the similarity to the standard C4, the shitty amenities including interiors, windshields, etc. doesn't exactly make them super desirable. While they are incredibly reliable, the perception is that they are finicky. Whether its injectors, fuel pumps, non-start due to valley drain issues, many need immediate attention and are perceived as difficult to work on and hard to find parts for.

These are not cars the super wealthy are looking for, and while there is hesitancy about what inflation and the market are going to do, I see these sitting right where they are at for the foreseeable future.

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

You can roll your eyes, but go look at BAT results and it shows exactly this. Clean C4s have gone up in value and comparable low mileage Lt1 and Lt4 cars are right there with ZR-1 closer to a 10k margin, not 15k.

There are lots of different perspectives on this. From the driver, to the collector, to the dealer.

Sure, if I had 6 ZR-1s on my car lot, I'd be hoping that wasn't the case.

They are definitely up over the last 2 years, but the entire market is. Clean low mileage cars are starting to bring much more of a premium over drivers cars than they did previously.

The market is cooling off again though. I think it's more of an overall market trend, because air cooled Porsches have leveled off as well. My sister just sold her clean 80k 1984 911 on BAT. BAT cars still bring a 10% premium over the rest of the market for whatever reason. But then, you can look at the 2000 Chevy Metro that just sold on there for 18k and never cease to be amazed at how people spend their money.

If these cars were going to catch that big break they've missed three opportunities that seemingly could have set the benchmark for an increase in popularity.

- The intro of the C6/C7 ZR1s
- The tsunami of a price increase on 90s cars from NSXs to Porsches, to Vipers, to 308s etc. In the time those cars were doubling in value, the ZR-1 sat still.
- Then the reintroduction of the second ever DOHC Corvette motor.

If none of those boosted the popularity, they probably just are what they are. That combined with the similarity to the standard C4, the shitty amenities including interiors, windshields, etc. doesn't exactly make them super desirable. While they are incredibly reliable, the perception is that they are finicky. Whether its injectors, fuel pumps, non-start due to valley drain issues, many need immediate attention and are perceived as difficult to work on and hard to find parts for.

These are not cars the super wealthy are looking for, and while there is hesitancy about what inflation and the market are going to do, I see these sitting right where they are at for the foreseeable future.


I agree with the highlighted.
Selling them between 40k and 70k.
Not just me.
Mecum.
BAT.
and others.
Very likely will continue, then higher.
:thumbsup:
:cheers:
Marty

[Racinfan83]

Well, I would let mine go in the $35k range, so if anyones interested?

[spork2367]

I agree with the highlighted.
Selling them between 40k and 70k.
Not just me.
Mecum.
BAT.
and others.
Very likely will continue, then higher.
:thumbsup:
:cheers:
Marty

I track all of this. More low mileage (sub 10k) cars have traded hands in auction this year than any previous year of record. That could mean two things (not mutually exclusive):

- The collector's market has picked up for the zr-1.
- People don't believe the low mileage cars are going to appreciate significantly beyond their current point.

For your 40-70k number, I would agree if we were talking sub 5k mile cars. Beyond that, no. And the data doesn't support that being the new "range." The range, inclusive of all mileage, but excluding damaged cars is 18-75k. Virtually no cars with over 10k miles have broken the 40k price barrier. Average by mileage:

sub 5k - 50057
sub 10k - 38855
10k+ - 29250

Opinions vary, data doesn't lie.

[onethumb]

I watched a 21k mile '95 sell for $40,700 at Barret Jackson a week ago. Bid to 37k plus 10% buyers fee.

It was a nice car, nothing special but a solid low-mile car that you'd be able to drive.

Just a couple of years ago that's a 25k car.

[RA42]

Greetings all. New here obviously and am thoroughly enjoying learning so much about these awesome cars. I have been looking to start collecting cars and always aspired to being able to go in with a C2 Big Block car, unfortunately 4 daughters and college threw some wrinkles there with the values, but who knows I am still relatively young and their mom and my bride is very understanding. HA

For now, I have an opportunity for a 94 ZR1, one-owner sub 15k miles. Car has been stored for 10+ years, and cosmetically it is a solid 8. Mechanically she has been dormant ever since parked. I am not super mechanical, but I do understand I am looking at potentially a nice chunk of change to bring her back, along with a host of unknowns since the battery is drained (electrical, seals, gaskets etc) plus tires. To make it more complicated the car sits on the opposite coast as I do.

My question is what is a reasonable fair price range for this car? And I have reached out to Marc Haibeck and he has helped me understand the potential repairs (he is incredibly knowledgeable and responsive) and if the car is bought will go there first. Also, I plan to drive her periodically, but also want to straddle the fence between preserving a low mileage original example if that is possible.

Sorry for the length of the post.
Thank you all.

[spork2367]

Greetings all. New here obviously and am thoroughly enjoying learning so much about these awesome cars. I have been looking to start collecting cars and always aspired to being able to go in with a C2 Big Block car, unfortunately 4 daughters and college threw some wrinkles there with the values, but who knows I am still relatively young and their mom and my bride is very understanding. HA

For now, I have an opportunity for a 94 ZR1, one-owner sub 15k miles. Car has been stored for 10+ years, and cosmetically it is a solid 8. Mechanically she has been dormant ever since parked. I am not super mechanical, but I do understand I am looking at potentially a nice chunk of change to bring her back, along with a host of unknowns since the battery is drained (electrical, seals, gaskets etc) plus tires. To make it more complicated the car sits on the opposite coast as I do.

My question is what is a reasonable fair price range for this car? And I have reached out to Marc Haibeck and he has helped me understand the potential repairs (he is incredibly knowledgeable and responsive) and if the car is bought will go there first. Also, I plan to drive her periodically, but also want to straddle the fence between preserving a low mileage original example if that is possible.

Sorry for the length of the post.
Thank you all.

35-37 in the current market. 40 if it had been serviced and was ready to drive. That is if it were to go to auction. Subtract maybe 2k from those prices for private party sales.

My .02.

[bb62]

I track all of this. More low mileage (sub 10k) cars have traded hands in auction this year than any previous year of record. That could mean two things (not mutually exclusive):

- The collector's market has picked up for the zr-1.
- People don't believe the low mileage cars are going to appreciate significantly beyond their current point.

For your 40-70k number, I would agree if we were talking sub 5k mile cars. Beyond that, no. And the data doesn't support that being the new "range." The range, inclusive of all mileage, but excluding damaged cars is 18-75k. Virtually no cars with over 10k miles have broken the 40k price barrier. Average by mileage:

sub 5k - 50057
sub 10k - 38855
10k+ - 29250

Opinions vary, data doesn't lie.

Using your numbers, what is the average of non-ZR-1 C4s sub-10K. It most certainly is not $23K. What average of base cars under 5K is selling for $35K. Your own numbers show you are wrong.

[RA42]

Thank you. I guess not knowing what?s lurking behind the corner I would be looking for feedback on what I should offer for the car. Realizing I need to outsource all the work to make it run again since been sitting for 10+ years.

Any range of numbers would greatly help in deciding to make an offer for this car. Even if you say run away that helps too.
Thanks again

[mlipmd]

Don't forget you will need 4 new tires - the ones on the car are shot even if they look brand new - plus the cost of mounting and balancing. And maybe every rubber hose needs replacement, plus oil/filter change, trans/diff fluid change, battery, AC recharge, Bose radio system rehab (new caps in CDM and speaker amps, CD and cassette rehab), transportation, and whatever else pops up. You will easily be adding $3-4000+ to whatever you offer. Ask MH what you could expect in extra costs, or have the car dropped off there on the way to you. In MHO, I would never buy something like that sight-unseen or without at least having some reputable person check it out first. I would think that's an $18-20,000 car in it's current state, esp. with an 8/10 cosmetic rating, hopefully the interior is not worn as that's another expense to rehab. You can find a better car closer to you, one that's been driven, used a little more, and well maintained. Some garage queens may be quite expensive to return to service. While everyone thinks their car commands a higher price than reality, those ridiculously high sales on BJ or Mecum or BAT are really unrealistic in the real world.

[spork2367]

Using your numbers, what is the average of non-ZR-1 C4s sub-10K. It most certainly is not $23K. What average of base cars under 5K is selling for $35K. Your own numbers show you are wrong.

You're reading way too much into a surface level comparison. The actual numbers I provided are ZR-1 only. There are just too many variables with standard c4s and very few are going to auction. I really don't watch them. In the ZR-1 world we are talking about 6 years with very few options other than color separating them. Standard C4s span 13 years with both convertibles and coupes, automatics, manuals, 4+3s, zf6s, 205 HP L83 through 330 HP Lt4s...

But they are climbing.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1986-chevrolet-corvette-36/

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1996-chevrolet-corvette-102/

[RA42]

Thanks. My gut says walk but I like the records and general conditions with the car. I did speak with MH and we came up with 7 ish to get it going including all the electrical radio etc. tires I figure are 2k I spoke to the owner and couldn?t face time because of signal strength but he did send about a dozen videos. However not having or knowing someone in that area to lay eyes on it I think I?m setting myself up for disappointment as far as what actually get.

Thanks so much for your feedback.

[onethumb]

If you ask, there may be someone here who can go check it out for you. But we don't know the location, so....

[RA42]

That is a great thought. In that spirit would anyone be interested in taking a look at a 1994 ZR1 in the Portland OR area? I am not sure how I would go about compensating for your time but I am more than happy to figure something out.

I think there is a way to PM someone on this forum, if you have interest then please do.

Thanks

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

That is a great thought. In that spirit would anyone be interested in taking a look at a 1994 ZR1 in the Portland OR area? I am not sure how I would go about compensating for your time but I am more than happy to figure something out.

I think there is a way to PM someone on this forum, if you have interest then please do.

Thanks

Would that be the black one that has been sitting since 2007?
:cheers:
Marty

[RA42]

Yes sir. Thoughts?

[mlipmd]

MH says ~$7000 he anticipates spending on that car? Doing what? Adding his 510HP package? Putting in a new engine? If the car needs that much work other than doing those two things - RUN - go find another car because that is ridiculous.

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

Yes sir. Thoughts?

7-10k to professionally and correctly re-awaken it, no upgrades.
That is IF nothing else went south before or during it's hibernation.
In the words of the great philosopher Dirty Harry, "Feeling lucky?"
If so; Roll the dice.
Good luck in your search and buy.
:cheers:
Marty

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

MH says ~$7000 he anticipates spending on that car? Doing what? Adding his 510HP package? Putting in a new engine? If the car needs that much work other than doing those two things - RUN - go find another car because that is ridiculous.

No upgrades, that is just going through it correctly at nominal technician rates, to undo and correct what years of storage has wrought, assuming no catastrophic things happened, such as freezing, vermin, water, or prior damage.
Do it yourselfers don't have to pay 100+ per hour, which certainly helps, provided they know what to do and how to do it without shortcuts, omissions, or being overly cheap.
Many on this forum COULD do it, but they are not usually the buyers.
For starters simply stare into the fuel tank, and hope no one turned the key.
Brain surgery looks pretty simple too, when performed by a professional.
:cheers:
Marty

[RA42]

Thanks for the advice. Looking forward to learning more about these cars and hopefully will find the right one for me.

[spork2367]

MH says ~$7000 he anticipates spending on that car? Doing what? Adding his 510HP package? Putting in a new engine? If the car needs that much work other than doing those two things - RUN - go find another car because that is ridiculous.

Tires: 1600
Battery: 175
Suspension Bushings: 300
Brake Pads/Hoses: 300
Injectors: 780
Fluid changes: 350
Fuel Pumps/Filter: 175
Radio/Amps: 700

Parts: 4380

Labor: 2620

Not bad for the number one ZR-1 shop in the country.

[RA42]

Thanks. I am still a little worried on the "what else" I might discover list. I am going to have at least 3500-4000 in freight and some extra in exterior refreshing as I think it will need a pro to do that. Bought right I am sure I would have an enjoyable car, but I feel as though if I am patient I could find the right car that might better serve my needs and expectations. Just on the fence

[RA42]

Also for the purpose of clarity, I wanted to state that Marc did not provide a quote it was a conversation and merely ballpark estimates of things it would need and things it most likely will need. If things are in a much more deteriorated state then obviously the expense swells.

Again thank to all for the feedback. Hoping to one day be an owner.
Best,
Rick

[RA42]

Hello all, Back to looking for someone to help me look at this 1994 ZR1 in the Portland, OR area. If you are interested please let me know. I am trying to find someone knowledgeable on Zs but as you can imagine hard to find and know this is the best chance I have. Happy to compensate you. Appreciate any and all help.

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

Rick,
Not sure what else "looking at it" would reveal.
It is a lower mile car so it SHOULD look good.

There is no escaping the cost of going through it in order to again make it road ready. The basic things must be done and you have an idea of the cost.

An inspection will not yield clues to any of the unknowns with what is essentially a barn find from a nicer barn.

I don't comment on prices of private owner vehicles.
However, the "value" of a low mile 94 is somewhat known.
Subtract from that number the estimated repair costs, and that would be the high target price.
Although with the unknowns, a further adjustment must be considered.

It would be far less of a gamble to fall in love with a well kept and maintained running car with full records from, ideally a Registry private party, most of whom would take great pains to make sure that you would know EXACTLY what you are getting.
There are dozens of nice sorted-out cars at all price levels that offer far more of a chance of avoiding the unknown.

Without knowing your potential real cost you are turning toy buying into a casino game. You might win, but..................

Often the car that seems like a "deal" may not be.

So again, back to the question you have to ask yourself.
"Do I feel lucky?"

Best wishes for a successful search and find!
:cheers:
Marty

[RA42]

Thanks Marty. Just trying to do my homework. I totally understand the mechanicals will go to MH and in my head have planned a placeholder on that cost. What I have now concluded is what the pictures don't show me regarding the paint, which admittedly concerns me as there is a ding in the fiberglass on the outer drivers door sill. I prefer not to repaint either A low mile example is a requirement of mine. Short of extreme low mile examples which I can not justify the price of at this moment (my only real data points are recent prices at auctions etc for sub 5k mile cars)this hits where I want with the exception being it is a barn find. On the flip side, someone needs to preserve this car right? Or at the very least bring it back to an operating life. All things being considered the gentleman selling it is certainly not thinking of it as a "barn find" of a vehicle that has yet to undergo significant appreciation...which it may or may not. He definitely has a very lofty opinion of the value. So I am just wanting to be fair but not stupid either and as a newbie I will probably end up being the later.

I have considered asking the community for leads on a car but suspect the price will require budget approval from my bride. If this car can be bought fairly then I can swing that without much fanfare and then pay for the repairs as it comes with MH. In other words too big of a check at once will get me the death stare....

Really appreciate you taking the time to help me.

Rick

[viper107]

ther is a nice black 94 on ebay ready to go..........................

[RA42]

Thanks. That will get the death stare, but I still enjoy looking....

Rick

[KJL]

That perception that the cars are difficult to work on is correct and some engine/drive train parts are not just hard to find...in some cases simply don't exist anymore.

[AirbusDriver]

93 ZR1 with less than 1,000 miles just sold for 86K plus the juice on BaT.

[Subfixer]

A 93 flood car sold on Copart for North of 17K. More than I was willing to spend.

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using ZR-1 Net Registry mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=90383)

[spork2367]

93 ZR1 with less than 1,000 miles just sold for 86K plus the juice on BaT.

Probably the rarest production C4 in existence, a sub 1k 93 anniversary edition zr-1. Not surprised in the price, but the market appears to be cooling. I think mid to late last year it would have broke 100k.

A 93 flood car sold on Copart for North of 17K. More than I was willing to spend.

Sent from my Pixel 4a (5G) using ZR-1 Net Registry mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=90383)

That's just idiocy.

[viper107]

Those ruby z cars for some reason are stunning in person to look at

[Meanmyz]

Those ruby z cars for some reason are stunning in person to look at

If the paint has been correctly cared for, they ARE stunning and the pictures on BAT highlight that. On the other hand, I have seen 40th Anniversary cars that didn't age very well at all.

Crazy for $86,000. Is that a new market high?

[lisounds]

a very nice 1995 just sold on bring a trailer keeping the spirit alive:thumbsup:

1,700-Mile 1995 Chevrolet Corvette ZR-1
Red/Black
1 top (solid red)
original goodyear gsc tires
3 owner car
Sold for $70,000 on 3/6/22

ADD $3,500 for the Buyers Fee brings the price to $73,500

[Meanmyz]

a very nice 1995 just sold on bring a trailer keeping the spirit alive:thumbsup:

1,700-Mile 1995 Chevrolet Corvette ZR-1
Red/Black
1 top (solid red)
original goodyear gsc tires
3 owner car
Sold for $70,000 on 3/6/22

ADD $3,500 for the Buyers Fee brings the price to $73,500


Hey Lisounds, I didn't check VIN numbers...that wasn't your car that you had for sale was it? ...I am pretty lazy to check when on my phone and haven't been real active on here lately. If so, congrats on a good sale! :cheers:

[Meanmyz]

Hey Lisounds, I didn't check VIN numbers...that wasn't your car that you had for sale was it? ...I am pretty lazy to check when on my phone and haven't been real active on here lately. If so, congrats on a good sale! :cheers:

No...my bad. This car came out of Colorado, not NY.

[ImpalaDave]

Those ruby z cars for some reason are stunning in person to look at


That's because they're drop dead gorgeous - as we both know!

[zyal8r]

Here's a short summary I posted in the Facebook group a couple days ago. This is a summary of highs I've observed for stock-ish ZR-1s:

The '93 for $86k is the highest I've seen.

Off the top of my head, the other significant ones:

- BaT black '95 with 145 miles sold for $71,500 and is now for sale at a dealership in CA for $85k (make that $79,900 - price just dropped...)

- BaT green/saddle '90 with 400 miles sold for $73k

- BaT quasar blue '90 with 1,100 miles sold for $60.6k (I think), and the secondaries were noted as not working.

- BaT black '95 with 2,200 miles sold for $51k or so.

- BaT '95 black with Dunn heads, 819 miles sold for $50k in August
- BaT 11k '95 sold for $43k with minor mods

Outside of BaT there were the three no-mile black ones ('90, '92, '94) from Mecum in January. I believe the sale prices on those were $66k, $5xk?, and the '94 with 29 miles sold for $82k. All three are now for sale at the same California dealership for $125k, $115k, and $125k, respectively.

- A '91 quasar blue from the same collection with 4k miles sold for either $51k or $56k at Mecum.

- Marty at Contes recently had a '95 blue/black - I think it was just sub 10k miles (?) asking price was $70k and it went very quickly, under a week.

- Two weeks ago there was a '94 blue/black 19k miles on eBay with BIN $46k, sold for just under $45k with two bids.

These are the highest I'm aware of. These were all stock or near stock. Nice, no- to low-mile cars are bringing good money.

I also have seen this site, which is a pretty good record of ZR-1s (and other classics) sold.

https://www.classic.com/m/chevrolet/corvette/c4/zr-1/

Mike

[viper107]

That's because they're drop dead gorgeous - as we both know!

big time!