11k mile 90 ZR-1 on BaT

[Mystic ZR-1]

Red on red, 11k miles, nice car!
4 days left, bid currently @ $10675
Another one to be given away?
Lots of uninformed comments in the Peanut Gallery
comment section... (to be fair, some intelligent ones too)
For example: the motor was built in Sterling Heights Michigan!
Sure... and I'll bet they think it was built by
Scott-Atwater too? 😋

[Vette73]

Do these cars have reserves on them ?
Clean looking Z with low mileage...
Seen a few very low mile examples ( less than 5K),owners asking mid 30s......Can't remember seeing any ZR-1s go for that high....
I believe there may have been a 90 with less than 200 miles sell for a tick over 30K at Mecum a few months ago..
Otherwise,that's it..

Sent from my LG-TP260 using ZR-1 Net Registry mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=90383)

[rush91]

That is an insane price for that Z, with that low of miles. One would think the price should be $22k......

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

Do these cars have reserves on them ?
Clean looking Z with low mileage...
Seen a few very low mile examples ( less than 5K),owners asking mid 30s......Can't remember seeing any ZR-1s go for that high....
I believe there may have been a 90 with less than 200 miles sell for a tick over 30K at Mecum a few months ago..
Otherwise,that's it..

Sent from my LG-TP260 using ZR-1 Net Registry mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=90383)



Really?
Wow.


Seriously,
Folks have to stop thinking that "auctions" are the end all, be all of car sales prices.
How many folks are at the auction?
1,000 maybe?
How many came there specifically to buy a high quality low mile ZR-1?
Any?
Likely not.
The buyer pool at an auction is small, and likely not the best pool for every car.
Most auctions draw people looking for a deal, particularly if they are a dealer looking to add to inventory. They certainly do not want to pay retail for a car that they intend to re-sell in the retail market. So if they can get it "right" they are happy to buy it, and re-sell it to a retail buyer.
That formula is disastrous for those in search of the most for the car that they are selling.
Auction prices are an important barometer of pricing, but mean little by themselves.
Certainly no one on this forum or others like it would sell "their" car for an auction or wholesale price. They would scoff at it, and say never, that their car is worth far more than the wholesale price, and in most all cases they are correct.
However, that means then that they must have their car prepared for sale, and exposed to as many in the target audience as is possible.
There is where things bog then break down. Owners get frustrated, bail, then cry that the market is so terrible, and these cars will never draw the money that they should, and on it goes.
It takes time, knowledge and effort to pull off a good price.
I do not buy cars at auctions.
While the prices are very tempting, there are usually reasons why the car is being sold at an auction. Some of those reasons are really good, like a rare and desirable car that has mass appeal, and can draw a good price.
However, it is also possible that the car has issues.
You simply do not know which it is with any certainty.
So if you do not want to take the chance, better to just look elsewhere.
I don't want to take the auction gamble for a car that I will be selling to many cases a friend. The risk is just too high.
Auctions will always sell cars and lots of them.
Most are good; some are not.
That is why in general the prices are so low.
It let's you have wins that might cover your losses.
Just keep that formula in mind if you are a retail buyer.
Not the kind of risk that I want to take on a car that I will be handing over the keys to a friend.
Marty

[spork2367]

Really?
Wow.


Seriously,
Folks have to stop thinking that "auctions" are the end all, be all of car sales prices.
How many folks are at the auction?
1,000 maybe?
How many came there specifically to buy a high quality low mile ZR-1?
Any?
Likely not.
The buyer pool at an auction is small, and likely not the best pool for every car.
Most auctions draw people looking for a deal, particularly if they are a dealer looking to add to inventory. They certainly do not want to pay retail for a car that they intend to re-sell in the retail market. So if they can get it "right" they are happy to buy it, and re-sell it to a retail buyer.
That formula is disastrous for those in search of the most for the car that they are selling.
Auction prices are an important barometer of pricing, but mean little by themselves.
Certainly no one on this forum or others like it would sell "their" car for an auction or wholesale price. They would scoff at it, and say never, that their car is worth far more than the wholesale price, and in most all cases they are correct.
However, that means then that they must have their car prepared for sale, and exposed to as many in the target audience as is possible.
There is where things bog then break down. Owners get frustrated, bail, then cry that the market is so terrible, and these cars will never draw the money that they should, and on it goes.
It takes time, knowledge and effort to pull off a good price.
I do not buy cars at auctions.
While the prices are very tempting, there are usually reasons why the car is being sold at an auction. Some of those reasons are really good, like a rare and desirable car that has mass appeal, and can draw a good price.
However, it is also possible that the car has issues.
You simply do not know which it is with any certainty.
So if you do not want to take the chance, better to just look elsewhere.
I don't want to take the auction gamble for a car that I will be selling to many cases a friend. The risk is just too high.
Auctions will always sell cars and lots of them.
Most are good; some are not.
That is why in general the prices are so low.
It let's you have wins that might cover your losses.
Just keep that formula in mind if you are a retail buyer.
Not the kind of risk that I want to take on a car that I will be handing over the keys to a friend.
Marty


They also shouldn't believe dealer prices are any better of a representation as an individual market segment. The auction, as a venue, is somewhat irrelevant when we're talking about cars that aren't custom, aren't super desirable, and there is no shortage of. You act like every auction is a random group of a**holes unknowingly bidding on cars. Those dockets are listed far in advance of the auction and more people go having an idea of what they are looking for than not. The ones who go with no idea typically aren't buying anything. Random "know nothings" aren't buying 30,000 dollar C4 corvettes when they see 8000 dollar C4s all day long. You think some random car buyer was sold on the ZR1 markup in the confines of a 1 minute auction?

30k is right where the market is on an extremely low mileage 1990. The fact that it ended up at an auction tells us it's probably just a low mileage car and not necessarily a concours car.

Why do you come into every one of these threads trying to convince everyone that every car sold at a low price isn't representative of the market? Because you've said the same thing about private party sales.

Want a good idea of what's a high price? Look at all the cars still for sale that have been for sale...for a year or more.

Why are so many cars being sold cheap and so many higher priced cars not selling? I'm sure it's just because people don't understand the market...

[Vette73]

Really?
Wow.


Seriously,
Folks have to stop thinking that "auctions" are the end all, be all of car sales prices.
How many folks are at the auction?
1,000 maybe?
How many came there specifically to buy a high quality low mile ZR-1?
Any?
Likely not.
The buyer pool at an auction is small, and likely not the best pool for every car.
Most auctions draw people looking for a deal, particularly if they are a dealer looking to add to inventory. They certainly do not want to pay retail for a car that they intend to re-sell in the retail market. So if they can get it "right" they are happy to buy it, and re-sell it to a retail buyer.
That formula is disastrous for those in search of the most for the car that they are selling.
Auction prices are an important barometer of pricing, but mean little by themselves.
Certainly no one on this forum or others like it would sell "their" car for an auction or wholesale price. They would scoff at it, and say never, that their car is worth far more than the wholesale price, and in most all cases they are correct.
However, that means then that they must have their car prepared for sale, and exposed to as many in the target audience as is possible.
There is where things bog then break down. Owners get frustrated, bail, then cry that the market is so terrible, and these cars will never draw the money that they should, and on it goes.
It takes time, knowledge and effort to pull off a good price.
I do not buy cars at auctions.
While the prices are very tempting, there are usually reasons why the car is being sold at an auction. Some of those reasons are really good, like a rare and desirable car that has mass appeal, and can draw a good price.
However, it is also possible that the car has issues.
You simply do not know which it is with any certainty.
So if you do not want to take the chance, better to just look elsewhere.
I don't want to take the auction gamble for a car that I will be selling to many cases a friend. The risk is just too high.
Auctions will always sell cars and lots of them.
Most are good; some are not.
That is why in general the prices are so low.
It let's you have wins that might cover your losses.
Just keep that formula in mind if you are a retail buyer.
Not the kind of risk that I want to take on a car that I will be handing over the keys to a friend.
Marty

True,auctions for the most part are a gamble....Best prices I see at auctions. are for high priced imports,BMW,Mercedes,Rolls Royce......A 220 thousand dollar rolls a few years old goes for less than half..Maybe even lower than that...

Also depends on the auction as well....I'm noticing a lot of disposable income thrown around at say Barrett Jackson....I mean 30K for a fox body mustang convertible?

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

They also shouldn't believe dealer prices are any better of a representation as an individual market segment. The auction, as a venue, is somewhat irrelevant when we're talking about cars that aren't custom, aren't super desirable, and there is no shortage of. You act like every auction is a random group of a**holes unknowingly bidding on cars. Those dockets are listed far in advance of the auction and more people go having an idea of what they are looking for than not. The ones who go with no idea typically aren't buying anything. Random "know nothings" aren't buying 30,000 dollar C4 corvettes when they see 8000 dollar C4s all day long. You think some random car buyer was sold on the ZR1 markup in the confines of a 1 minute auction?

30k is right where the market is on an extremely low mileage 1990. The fact that it ended up at an auction tells us it's probably just a low mileage car and not necessarily a concours car.

Why do you come into every one of these threads trying to convince everyone that every car sold at a low price isn't representative of the market? Because you've said the same thing about private party sales.

Want a good idea of what's a high price? Look at all the cars still for sale that have been for sale...for a year or more.

Why are so many cars being sold cheap and so many higher priced cars not selling? I'm sure it's just because people don't understand the market...



Well, at least you have proven to all that you certainly have a commanding understanding of it.
Marty

[KILLSHOTS]

They also shouldn't believe dealer prices are any better of a representation as an individual market segment. The auction, as a venue, is somewhat irrelevant when we're talking about cars that aren't custom, aren't super desirable, and there is no shortage of. You act like every auction is a random group of a**holes unknowingly bidding on cars. Those dockets are listed far in advance of the auction and more people go having an idea of what they are looking for than not. The ones who go with no idea typically aren't buying anything. Random "know nothings" aren't buying 30,000 dollar C4 corvettes when they see 8000 dollar C4s all day long. You think some random car buyer was sold on the ZR1 markup in the confines of a 1 minute auction?

30k is right where the market is on an extremely low mileage 1990. The fact that it ended up at an auction tells us it's probably just a low mileage car and not necessarily a concours car.

Why do you come into every one of these threads trying to convince everyone that every car sold at a low price isn't representative of the market? Because you've said the same thing about private party sales.

Want a good idea of what's a high price? Look at all the cars still for sale that have been for sale...for a year or more.

Why are so many cars being sold cheap and so many higher priced cars not selling? I'm sure it's just because people don't understand the market...


Actually, the market for an extremely low mile '90 is not even anywhere near 30K. If it was, then that 383 mile example in Anaheim would not have sat forever at $28,900. I had them down to 26K but walked away for various reasons. It finally did sell and for how much, I do not know but it was definitely quite a bit less than 30K. Maybe that's the market for a PERFECTLY SORTED '90...

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

Actually, the market for an extremely low mile '90 is not even anywhere near 30K. If it was, then that 383 mile example in Anaheim would not have sat forever at $28,900. I had them down to 26K but walked away for various reasons. It finally did sell and for how much, I do not know but it was definitely quite a bit less than 30K. Maybe that's the market for a PERFECTLY SORTED '90...



As I recall, wasn't that the car that did not run even though it had new injectors?
Marty

[spork2367]

True,auctions for the most part are a gamble....Best prices I see at auctions. are for high priced imports,BMW,Mercedes,Rolls Royce......A 220 thousand dollar rolls a few years old goes for less than half..Maybe even lower than that...

Also depends on the auction as well....I'm noticing a lot of disposable income thrown around at say Barrett Jackson....I mean 30K for a fox body mustang convertible?

Those high priced imports suffer the same depreciation across the market, auction, private party and dealer sales. That's based on the fact that someone bought a mass production car for 250k, got 30k worth of car and 220k worth of self righteousness. You can't resell the self righteousness...lol.

Well, at least you have proven to all that you certainly have a commanding understanding of it.
Marty

You criticize or dismiss almost every sale that is lower than what you think it should be. I'm not sure that demonstrates a command of anything other than you trying to justify dealership markups. Which I've said before, may or may not be worth it to the buyers on a personal basis.

Let's face it, dealerships, individual sellers, and auctions ultimately don't control what the market is willing to bear, the market does.

If you bought ZR1s for what you claim they should sell for, you wouldn't make one red cent!

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

Those high priced imports suffer the same depreciation across the market, auction, private party and dealer sales. That's based on the fact that someone bought a mass production car for 250k, got 30k worth of car and 220k worth of self righteousness. You can't resell the self righteousness...lol.



You criticize or dismiss almost every sale that is lower than what you think it should be. I'm not sure that demonstrates a command of anything other than you trying to justify dealership markups. Which I've said before, may or may not be worth it to the buyers on a personal basis.

Let's face it, dealerships, individual sellers, and auctions ultimately don't control what the market is willing to bear, the market does.

If you bought ZR1s for what you claim they should sell for, you wouldn't make one red cent!



Sport,
I sell them for the money they are worth, and before you ask your next question, yes, for some money heavier than what you think they are worth
To be clear, you don't make the market either. you DO understand that don't you?
Markets, auctions, and dealers do not buy cars, people do.


By the way, why not show me some pictures of your car, and I will let you know what it might be worth.
Marty

[KILLSHOTS]

As I recall, wasn't that the car that did not run even though it had new injectors?
Marty


Yeah, it had bad fuel pumps. They had replaced the entire assembly at Corvette Mikes and it was running fine after that.

[spork2367]

Sport,
I sell them for the money they are worth, and before you ask your next question, yes, for some money heavier than what you think they are worth
To be clear, you don't make the market either. you DO understand that don't you?
Markets, auctions, and dealers do not buy cars, people do.


By the way, why not show me some pictures of your car, and I will let you know what it might be worth.
Marty

Champ,

People are the market. I am a person, I have purchased cars, I am part of the market. I never said or implied I was the market as a whole if you inferred that somewhere.

I have stated twice that some people are willing to pay a dealer markup because the car is sorted out for them and they don't want to do that themselves. That's why used car dealers continue to exist.

Auctions aren't part of the market because they never own the car and dealers are only intermediary owners. You could argue that a dealer purchasing a car was part of the market, but most valuation companies don't calculate in those purchases, but instead the ultimate selling price from the dealer.

My cars aren't worth sh*t, I don't need you to tell me that.

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

Champ,

People are the market. I am a person, I have purchased cars, I am part of the market. I never said or implied I was the market as a whole if you inferred that somewhere.

I have stated twice that some people are willing to pay a dealer markup because the car is sorted out for them and they don't want to do that themselves. That's why used car dealers continue to exist.

Auctions aren't part of the market because they never own the car and dealers are only intermediary owners. You could argue that a dealer purchasing a car was part of the market, but most valuation companies don't calculate in those purchases, but instead the ultimate selling price from the dealer.

My cars aren't worth sh*t, I don't need you to tell me that.



I try not to argue, so I won't debate any of your points, especially the highlighted ones..
I will agree with you actually.
Well sorted out, extremely well maintained, very low mileage cars are always worth a premium.
Most cars owned by Forum members typically fall into that category, and are indeed worth more than the low prices found and often cited as "the market price".
A 500 mile 90 that is right, and I mean really right sells to some for 35-38.
I have sold "right" 15k mile 90's for 30.
So yes, I would buy it in the mid to high twenties, sort it out, then sell it as above.
So is the market price 26?
Yes, barely running as that one was 26 was close to it.
Ahh, but sorted out? Far different answer.
It does not matter who does the sorting, it just needs to be done and done correctly, but once done, it is no longer a 26k car.
Often sellers just get frustrated and want out, and sell the car for what they can get NOW.
By definition that is NOT a market price. They have put undue pressure on themselves and therefore have deviated from a pure market price, but by their own doing.
I will also agree with what you said earlier. If you want high market price it takes time to find the right buyer who wants THAT car, and is willing to pay a premium for it because it is exactly what they want. Yes, that can take a year or more, but I am OK with that.
Fast always costs money regardless if we are talking racing fast or selling fast.
Drive fast; Sell Slow!
Marty

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

Yeah, it had bad fuel pumps. They had replaced the entire assembly at Corvette Mikes and it was running fine after that.

No surprise there; as expected.
It's a shame that wasn't thought of before the injectors.
That does tell me whoever awakened that sleeping beauty either made a mistake or took a shortcut.
That is unfortunate for that seller, but VERY fortunate for the new owner.
I so wished that car would have been on the East Coast.
I love sleeping beauties, because I love low mile pristine cars!
That car will make someone very happy.
Marty

[KILLSHOTS]

No surprise there; as expected.
It's a shame that wasn't thought of before the injectors.
That does tell me whoever awakened that sleeping beauty either made a mistake or took a shortcut.
That is unfortunate for that seller, but VERY fortunate for the new owner.
I so wished that car would have been on the East Coast.
I love sleeping beauties, because I love low mile pristine cars!
That car will make someone very happy.
Marty

It actually had been thought of. Back in 2016, the car had a complete fuel system rebuild when it was taken out of storage prior to auction. Somehow, in the time since, one or both of the pumps failed. They were new in '16, though; I saw the entire pump assembly that came out of it recently and it looked brand new. It was a very nice car but it needed a complete stereo rebuild, various seat components, some weatherstripping and new plastic on the clear top, among other things. In the end, I wasn't looking for garage art, but also didn't have the heart to drive it and watch the value plummet.

[Mystic ZR-1]

Red on red, 11k miles, nice car!
4 days left, bid currently @ $10675
Another one to be given away?
Lots of uninformed comments in the Peanut Gallery
comment section... (to be fair, some intelligent ones too)
For example: the motor was built in Sterling Heights Michigan!
Sure... and I'll bet they think it was built by
Scott-Atwater too? 😋

Bid currently @ $13450
2 days to go...

[Mystic ZR-1]

Bid currently @ $15000
One day left

Who's "Greybeard ZR-1"?

[PhillipsLT5]

I remember that handle

[Mystic ZR-1]

I remember that handle

He made some ZR-1 knowledgeable remarks on the BaT
site about the car under bid.
Thought he might be a member here?

[PhillipsLT5]

Thats clean, WOW!, I wonder what reserve is?

[Mystic ZR-1]

Sold for $24k
Should have been 3 times that...
(So much for preaching to the choir)
I guess supposedly, that's the "market", however
you want to describe it...

[spork2367]

Sold for $24k
Should have been 3 times that...
(So much for preaching to the choir)
I guess supposedly, that's the "market", however
you want to describe it...

Three times that for a 1990!.... Really, 72k??? A concours low mileage 95 isn’t worth that.

[Mystic ZR-1]

Three times that for a 1990!.... Really, 72k??? A concours low mileage 95 isn’t worth that.

Do I really have to explain what I meant by that remark???
What have you been doing in the choir box?
Obviously, not listening to the sermon...

[EvanZR1]

Final price was $24K.

[spork2367]

Do I really have to explain what I meant by that remark???
What have you been doing in the choir box?
Obviously, not listening to the sermon...

You didn’t seem to have an opinion one way or another, so I didn’t really follow the sarcasm, unless you’re just pointing out that it went for pretty much what it’s worth.

[BigJohn]

Just Doug wishful thinking!

[efnfast]

Just Doug wishful thinking!
Just most of us wishful thinking. Although, if that's where the market was, I wouldn't own one.

[Bob Eyres]

Bid currently @ $15000
One day left

Who's "Greybeard ZR-1"?


That was me :D

$24K?.....All those years, and only 11K mi.? Kinda sad ain't it? But a good opportunity for the car guy that doesn't have the big bucks to buy a new ZR-1. And a good lesson for the guys that think cars are a commodity, not meant to be driven.

I hope the new owner starts putting miles on right away, and shows up at "The Gathering". :cheers: