Clutch component purchase...

[Roadster]

After making a purchase a few months ago, I finally unpacked it today....
This was off a ZR-1 with 40K miles. There are lots of pics when unpacked and after a quick cleanup of the parts. I am no clutch expert by any means, so those in the know feel free to comment on the condition of these parts.
Also the DMF has slight movement from side to side. I would imagine that this is good??? Meaning that the flywheel springs are still good???

Packed very well from the shipper...
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_103252.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_103252.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104345.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104345.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104630.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104630.jpg.html)

[Roadster]

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104643.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104643.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104653.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104653.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104711.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104711.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104751.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104751.jpg.html)

[Roadster]

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104832.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104832.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104858.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104858.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104911.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104911.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104919.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104919.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_105018.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_105018.jpg.html)

[Roadster]

After a slight cleanup....
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115031.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115031.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115042.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115042.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115115.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115115.jpg.html)

[Roadster]

clutch disc looks good to me...
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115135.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115135.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115215.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115215.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115224.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115224.jpg.html)
Pressure Plate....
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115318.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115318.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115337.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115337.jpg.html)
Also included was the clutch fork...
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_132529.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_132529.jpg.html)

[Hib Halverson]

Clutch disc certainly looks useable but that clutch...hope you didn't pay much for it because it's been run pretty hard as has the flywheel.

You put that stuff in your car and it's may chatter.

There are a few...very few...machine shops which can machine a DM flywheel. If you can find one, I'd have it done. Then I'd buy a new clutch.

[Roadster]

Clutch disc certainly looks useable but that clutch...hope you didn't pay much for it because it's been run pretty hard as has the flywheel.

You put that stuff in your car and it's may chatter.

There are a few...very few...machine shops which can machine a DM flywheel. If you can find one, I'd have it done. Then I'd buy a new clutch.

I know I took a chance, I also have an AC/Delco NOS Valeo Pressure Plate & Clutch disc. just in case these were shot. I know of one maybe two places who can cut the DMF. The main reason I bought these parts was for the flywheel.
Not going in my car anytime soon, but for whatever time in the future.
The total cost was much less than just buying a DMF, and I got a clutch fork with it...

[Hib Halverson]

I know I took a chance, I also have an AC/Delco NOS Valeo Pressure Plate & Clutch disc. just in case these were shot. I know of one maybe two places who can cut the DMF. The main reason I bought these parts was for the flywheel.
Not going in my car anytime soon, but for whatever time in the future.
The total cost was much less than just buying a DMF, and I got a clutch fork with it...

If you decide to have the DM wheel machined, hopefully the secondary mass, which has the clutch friction surface, is not warped as you want to take the minimum amount possible off the secondary mass. The more you cut off that secondary mass, the hotter the secondary mass runs.

DM wheels were a great idea to quiet the S6-40, but, IMO, their durability sucks plus their are heavier than s**t. When I had the late Jim Van Dorn build the engine in Barney, I replaced the DM wheel with an aluminum wheel. Wow. What a difference! Better throttle response for sure and the engine accelerated just a bit quicker.

The increase in gear rattle was not a big deal as I enhanced ignition performance at idle to decrease misfire and I used Red Line Light Shockproof Gear Lubricant which quieted some of the gear rattle.

[Roadster]

If you decide to have the DM wheel machined, hopefully the secondary mass, which has the clutch friction surface, is not warped as you want to take the minimum amount possible off the secondary mass. The more you cut off that secondary mass, the hotter the secondary mass runs.

DM wheels were a great idea to quiet the S6-40, but, IMO, their durability sucks plus their are heavier than s**t. When I had the late Jim Van Dorn build the engine in Barney, I replaced the DM wheel with an aluminum wheel. Wow. What a difference! Better throttle response for sure and the engine accelerated just a bit quicker.

The increase in gear rattle was not a big deal as I enhanced ignition performance at idle to decrease misfire and I used Red Line Light Shockproof Gear Lubricant which quieted some of the gear rattle.

Appreciate the input Hal, I had already spoke to someone before I made the purchase concerning the cut for the DMF. They assured me that they have the right machinery to do the job. So I went ahead and made the purchase. Yes they are heavier than s**t for sure.

My trans make absolutely no noise at all, and I would be leery of going with an aluminum wheel for the noise issue when the time for replacement arises.

Just have to contact the person and get it done....

[Racinfan83]

Jim Jandik at Power Torque Systems can resurface the clutch plate - not sure if he can do the flywheel or not. When I had mine apart last spring it looked WAY better then those pieces.. Mine has 21k miles - funny thing is my disc looked about like that one which is in good shape - but my PP and flywheel looked a lot better then those. I had Jim resurface my PP mainly for peace of mind and I wanted him to inspect the TO bearing. Sent him pics of my flywheel and he said to just clean it up with Scotchbrite and it would be fine. And it is. Not sure why those look so hot when the disc looks like it does unless someone just threw another disc in there??

[XfireZ51]

If I am going through the hassle of removing and reinstalling a trans, fw, etc, no way am I installing a used clutch disk. I agree w Hib, dump the weight and go w a low mass FW.
There are ways of mitigating the rattle.

[Roadster]

Appreciate all of the remarks.....Jim @ Power Torque was the person I spoke to before I made the purchase mentioned. I also had him rebuild my clutch MC and purchased a stock slave from him a few years ago. I also new that I was taking a chance making this purchase. He did mentioned that they can cut the DM (as Craig said)and have cut some already. Tried contacting him yesterday, but he may be out on the race circuit this week.
As mentioned I do have a NOS PP and clutch disc that was sitting on the self since 2004 from another purchase. And yes there is the possibility that the disc in the pics above with this purchase may have been added, as the disc looks pretty good.
Just putting away parts for the future, making easier for when the grandsons inherit the Vettes.

I rather stay stock, but then that may be just me. I read to many stories when some owners have been unhappy with going to low mass FW. Again I don't have any noise from my trans and just don't want to take the chance changing to something different down the road. And this is something I don't need to change soon, who knows my current setup may well last for a long time.

So right now I have 3 PP's, one in the Z, a NOS unit and the one shown in the pics. Also have 3 clutch discs, the same as just mentioned. And now have 2 DMF's, which both can be cut and hopefully reused once again when or if ever needed.

Cost, yes cost....for what I spent on the two separate purchases between the new NOS and used original pieces, it was still less than purchasing a NOS DMF, if you can find any. Or less or close to buying a used DMF in good condition, again if you can find one. And if Jim can cut the PP & DM shown and still be in specs, then I would say I did good=D>. If not[-X, then I still have the NOS pieces and some expensive wall or table art.......lol

[Racinfan83]

I thought about going with the LW flywheel when I had mine apart. What kept me from it was remembering when I was at Marc's and he started one up to move it - I about freaked because it sounded like it had a rod fixin to come out the bottom. He said no that was the aluminum flywheel. I'm not driving something that sounds like the engine could ventilate at any moment...:confused:

[Paul Workman]

I thought about going with the LW flywheel when I had mine apart. What kept me from it was remembering when I was at Marc's and he started one up to move it - I about freaked because it sounded like it had a rod fixin to come out the bottom. He said no that was the aluminum flywheel. I'm not driving something that sounds like the engine could ventilate at any moment...:confused:

Another vote for the Al FW, and bumping the idle. Like Hib and Dom said, the accelleration - especially in the lower gears...is well worth the sometes rattle. ;)

[Racinfan83]

Maybe - but I've blown up enough stuff in my life - and I don't like that sound.. It has been an expensive sound for me over the years..LOL:cheers:

[Roadster]

Just spoke to Jim @PowerTorque, and will be sending him the set-up next week. After reviewing the pics here, he feels that both the PP and DMF will come out very good after being machined. He also determined that the set-up is from a 90, and has the first gen clutch disc. This disc has the single set of rivets around the disc. There were four different generations of clutch discs during the ZR-1 time. He is going to check everything out including the disc, to determine if the disc is still usable.
He also mentioned that Valeo most likely stopped production of our parts in 2005, before they were sourced elsewhere for production. So the other NOS set I purchased seems to be one of the last actually produced by them. The other disc has two sets of rivets around the disc, which indicates a 4th generation disc. And the PP also has the later "letter" designation "F" as opposed to the earlier "letter" designation "A" as which is on the 90 unit.

We also discussed the differences between SM & DMF's, the pro's and con's of using the different units. I still prefer to stay stock as much as I can. I don't race or track the Z, so whatever added benefit there is would not benefit me. Just glad to have back up parts ready to go when needed.

Always enjoy our conversations, Jim has a wealth of knowledge as do many members here on the forum. Now if only I can remember everything.....
hmmmm.....that would be a good thing.......:)

[XfireZ51]

Hib,

Curious to have your expertise and thoughts about a SM steel flywheel? I heard there was one available and might be a good compromise for those of us that don't want the rattle? I had the Fidanza SM aluminum and loved it, but could not stand the rattle. The problem is I had SGC Stage I cams that compounded the rattle and I could not tune it out totally with ignition or trans lube. I guess I could tolerate it with a stock cammed motor; not sure. I'll have to hear one at a Gathering or other event in the US. Thanks for your thoughts.

Craig,

Stage 1s are pretty tame. U need someone who knows how to tune. 😃

[Roadster]

Received an email today from Jim @PowerTorque where all of my clutch components are and waiting to be cut. He mentioned that everything looked great, the items are prepped and should all be done by the end of the week.
Even the T.O. bearing is looking good, and sees no problem to reuse.
So I feel really good that this was a good purchase, very excited to see the finished parts when they return.
Hopefully I won't ever need them, but they will be there for my grandsons in the future so they can still have some OEM parts whenever replacement time happens....:dancing

[Roadster]

Another email from Jim today, this time his findings with the clutch disc shown in the previous posts, especially #5. Great news!!!

"Tom,

Keep the disc! It measures an average of .295" at 1/8" in from the outside edge, so it definitely has life left in it. You can run these discs down to .230" or so before they need to be replaced. New, this disc was probably around .315" - .325".

Those 1st gen. Valeo discs (which this one is) have a high copper content within the organic facing material and I like them. Copper grabs better the hotter it gets within the clutch, so these discs don't tend to slip.


---Jim"

[Roadster]

Received my UPS delivery a few hours ago from Jim @PowerTorque with my clutch components. Everything checked out fine.
Here is what was done:
1-clutch disc checked and thickness measured...
measures an average of .295" at 1/8" in from the outside edge,
you can run these discs down to .230"
new ones measure around .315" - .325".

2-PP cut...
excellent condition

3-TO bearing checked and greased...
you can grab the outside corners and spin it freely

4-DMF checked and cut...
Jim took measurement of FW rotation which came out to 9/16", new ones measures at 1/2" rotation. The DMF is excellent as Jim mentioned. It is in like new condition.

All in all Jim was extremely satisfied with all of the parts. Whenever installed they will last for a very long time. So my purchase turned out to be a good decision. I took a chance and am very fortunate with the results.

Here are some pics....
Before pic PP...http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104711.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_104711.jpg.html)
Delivery unpacked...
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170323_143810.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170323_143810.jpg.html)
After PP cut...
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170323_144438.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170323_144438.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170323_144521.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170323_144521.jpg.html)

[Roadster]

DMF before pic...
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115031.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170228_115031.jpg.html)
After being cut...
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170323_144601.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170323_144601.jpg.html)
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p138/SSROADSTER/94%20ZR-1/20170323_144748.jpg (http://s127.photobucket.com/user/SSROADSTER/media/94%20ZR-1/20170323_144748.jpg.html)