Need help troubleshooting Cooling problem

[Xdt]

Guys,
As stated in title I am having an issue with my cooling system. I recently did radiator replacement, due to a crack in the tank.

So I installed new GM radiator, Thermostat and gasket, new hoses and pressure cap.I bled the system using the method outlined in the solution post, which is to blow through the drivers side port to push coolant through water pump, to remove air from system.

I started car and once car got to temperature I noticed neither fan was running, coolant was overflowing through reservoir high fill, and temperature gauge was climbing past mid point. Immediately turned off ignition :confused::confused:

***Below describes what I have tried thus far:***
1) New radiator cap, did not solve problems
2) Jumpered fans at obd1 port. Both fans ran as they should
3) Rented Motörad cooling tester. System held 17 psi for 2minutes (2 minutes was time stated in motorad maunal).

Please let me know what to try next....

Thank you

[Xdt]

Anyone?

[efnfast]

These engines can be a real bitch to get all the air out of. I ASSUME the rad cap was on tight? If it was and you were blowing out the over flow, there were some bad stant thermostats out there that would over pressurize the system and blow the radiator. I couldn't tell you how to identify the right thermostat.

[Xdt]

Efnfast
Thanks for the reply. Now that the system is filled with coolant how do you recommend I re bleed lthe system? Also would air in the line cause the fans not to run?

[efnfast]

I don't know how to confirm that the thermostat is correct. If it has to high a pressure spring, rumor has it it can pop the radiator and that would be bad.
If the water pump is circulating water, the air should work its way out.
The fans come on pretty high with a stock program. Is this a car you are familure with?
I should know this.. stock the primary fan comes on at 205? and the secondary comes on at 215? Maybe higher? I know on my 90 the temp gauge was way to the high side before the secondary came on, scary high.

[Xdt]

I purchased the thermostat from one of our supporting vendors. I will purchase another if needed.

So, if the coolant is over flowing through the pressure cap. I guess it's either thermostat or water pump?
Any ideas please keep them coming.

[RussMcB]

I wonder if there is a way to tell if the water pump is moving coolant. Perhaps there is air in the impellers.

[Xdt]

RussMcB,
I will drain some of the coolant and bleed system again. Any ideas of an alternate bleed method?

[Dynomite]

RussMcB,
I will drain some of the coolant and bleed system again. Any ideas of an alternate bleed method?

Are the two Injector Housing Coolant Manifolds getting warm within a minute? If so.....your coolant is flowing and the water pump is working.

And you do not have an Air Locked Water Pump. That is the only purpose of the methods you used is to insure you do not have an air locked water pump.

Now....if the Injector Housing Coolant Manifolds do not get warm.....your water pump is Air Locked or the Impeller is spinning on the shaft.

We are also assuming you installed the Thermostat correctly. We are also assuming it is a 180 deg Thermostat although any degree thermostat should allow the Injector Coolant Manifolds to get warm within a minute.

Am also assuming you did not remove the belt and install it incorrectly and coolant hoses are installed correctly.

coolant was overflowing through reservoir high fill, .
Thank you

What exactly does this mean???

Sounds like the water pump is working but the thermostat is installed incorrectly........but......an explanation is required.

[ssrszz4]

Upside down

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[Xdt]

Dynomite,

The Injector housing manifolds do get warm within a minute.
I know the Thermostat is correct, purchased it from Jerry.
The belt was removed, and I verified per manual that routing was correct.

Explanations for "coolant was overflowing through reservoir high fill"

The coolant leaks past the pressure cap which is located on the black plastic tank located on passenger side of car. Instead of flowing to the white overflow tank , the coolant spews past the pressure cap on the black tank.

Please elaborate on Thermostat installation. I thought I installed new Thermostat as the old Thermostat. But, I could have made an error.

Thank you again for the assistance.

[Dynomite]

Instead of flowing to the white overflow tank , the coolant spews past the pressure cap on the black tank.

Please elaborate on Thermostat installation. I thought I installed new Thermostat as the old Thermostat. But, I could have made an error.

Thank you again for the assistance.

I am assuming the vent between the Black Tank in front of passenger side windshield and the White Overflow tank beneath the passenger side headlight is not blocked.

Looking at the photo.......I do not know how you can install it the wrong way but may be crooked or maybe the wrong way.
The Bottom of the thermostat in the photo faces toward the drivers side in the thermostat housing.

The Top of the thermostat with the gasket faces into the part of the thermostat housing toward the Passenger Side. The black gasket is sandwiched in a groove between the Passenger Side and Drivers Side halves of the thermostat housing. It is difficult but using a putty knife to hold the thermostat in place during assembly does work.

Thermostat rubber seal install TIPS (http://www.zr1.net/forum/showthread.php?p=139426)


http://i287.photobucket.com/albums/ll142/dynomite007/Dynomite12/23d8abf6-05e1-436c-8049-d58b3ad16c03.png

See Item #6 Blocking TB Coolant, Fluidyne Radiator and Thermostats (http://www.corvetteforum.com/forums/c4-zr-1-discussion/3005470-tech-info-lt5-modifications-rebuild-tricks-500-hp-12.html#post1590759179)

[mike100]

I had trouble the first time I refilled water after a radiator job/ injector pull- I don't recall what the repair was, but i do remember worrying that I could not bleed the air bubble out of the top of the engine to restore flow.

A quick way to know if the water pump has a head of water coming through it is to remove the expansion tank cap to see if the rubber vent line near the cap has a stream of water pissing back into the tank. If not, then jack up the passenger side of the car as high as your highest jack will take it. Start the car and top up the system. This has purged the air pocket every time for me.

[Dynomite]

I had trouble the first time I refilled water after a radiator job/ injector pull- I don't recall what the repair was, but i do remember worrying that I could not bleed the air bubble out of the top of the engine to restore flow.

A quick way to know if the water pump has a head of water coming through it is to remove the expansion tank cap to see if the rubber vent line near the cap has a stream of water pissing back into the tank. If not, then jack up the passenger side of the car as high as your highest jack will take it. Start the car and top up the system. This has purged the air pocket every time for me.

His Injector Housing Coolant Manifolds get warm within a minute of starting the engine.....his Water Pump is Pumping Coolant :cheers:

[Xdt]

Dynamite,
i have the thermostat installed as you described. However, based on the link you have provided I appears the thermostat should be oriented with the slots in a horizontal position. If this is true would the slots in a vertical position cause my problem?

[Dynomite]

Dynamite,
i have the thermostat installed as you described. However, based on the link you have provided I appears the thermostat should be oriented with the slots in a horizontal position. If this is true would the slots in a vertical position cause my problem?

NO EFFECT ........vertical or horizontal is the same as far as coolant flow.

From your description it appears to me that you have coolant squirting out of the coolant cap on top of the Black Coolant Reservoir???
That is strange......maybe the wrong coolant cap .........maybe coolant path blocked to Overflow tank.........

Do you have a 15 psi cap?
Your Coolant path between the white tank and black tank has got to be clogged.
Or......you have so much flow to the Black Tank that that the path between the two tanks cannot handle the flow raising the pressure above 15 psi........which means something else is going on.

Or.....the white coolant tank is not vented....but 15 lbs would blow that cap off.....:D

[Xdt]

Yes, my problems are fans not running as temp climb and coolant squirting out of Black Coolant Reservoir.
Pressure cap is 17lb GM unit, I will check coolant path tomorrow evening.

Thanks to all that have provided feedback, greatly appreciated. Please continue to post all ideas.

[Dynomite]

Yes, my problems are fans not running as temp climb and coolant squirting out of Black Coolant Reservoir.
Pressure cap is 17lb GM unit, I will check coolant path tomorrow evening.

Thanks to all that have provided feedback, greatly appreciated. Please continue to post all ideas.

I recall Secondary fan turns on at 228 deg F and Primary fan turns on at 219 deg F.
I also recall fans turn off with a drop of 11 deg F more or less. With a chip....Marc sets the fans on at 205 deg F and off at 200 deg F.

If you are running with a 180 deg Thermostat on a cool day......you would not see the fans come on at all unless you have a chip.

You pressure cap (radiator cap on top of black coolant tank) could be suspect also. You really do not say what the coolant temperature is.....Using HVAC......push and hold two fan up and down button at same time getting a zero....then up fan looking for 16. Then push center fan button and read coolant temperature in deg C.

90 C = 193 F
93 C - 199 F
95 C = 202 F
97 C = 206 F
100 C = 211 F
105 C = 220 F
110 C = 230 F

[A26B]

.........The coolant leaks past the pressure cap which is located on the black plastic tank located on passenger side of car. Instead of flowing to the white overflow tank , the coolant spews past the pressure cap on the black tank. .........


I don't think you have the pressure cap all the way installed. Press down hard & turn more to the right. You are probably just half way on.

[Dynomite]

I don't think you have the pressure cap all the way installed. Press down hard & turn more to the right. You are probably just half way on.

There you go......:cheers:

and his 17 lb cap will take a couple more pounds push than the 15 lb cap ;)

[Xdt]

Dynamite,
I will verify lines are not blocked and provide feedback on the exact temperature coolant spills over.

Once temp gage went over mid point and coolant spilled over I immediately turned off ignition. Never thought to check exact temperature.

[HAWAIIZR-1]

I'm not sure if I missed it looking at this on my phone, but did you "burp" your system as recommended by Marc Haibeck, the ZR-1 Specialist? It is fail proof and works every time. About over 10 years ago I had similar and it was air in my system.

http://www.zr1specialist.com/HAT%20Web/articles/Filling%20the%20LT5%20With%20Coolant.pdf




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[GOLDCYLON]

Turn the AC on do the fans come on ?

[S.hafsmo]

Stock setup for a '90 is primary fan start @ 194°F, secondary fan start @ 230°F.
This acc. to LT5 fuel and emission course book.

[S.hafsmo]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170123/0bb929e97d41b76dd7ed7da5e0c640c0.jpg

Apologies if it's not relevant. Got a bit bored and was going through the book now anyway.

[mike100]

I suppose for a sanity check, take the old and new thermostats and throw them both in a pan of boiling water just to be sure they open at the same time.

[DRM500RUBYZR-1]

Puzzling.
IF....
You have been putting the radiator cap on FULLY, and it still pushes coolant to the overflow tank, that would indicate pressure beyond the caps rates 17 lbs, or a failed cap.

Where did your original tank fail?
and, was the failure caused by excessive pressure?

I would perform a pressure test in order to rule out or determine if something else might be going on.

Keep up posting your findings.

:cheers:

Marty

[Xdt]

Okay guys just thought I would provide an update. Before I get started,once again let me thank everyone for the assistance.

1) As suggested verified cap was fastened properly. Went all the way to last notch, no change, but good suggestion.
2) Once car cooled thought I would check New Delco cap 6410962 (Rock Auto)and with pressure tester. New cap would not make it to 17psi as stated on cap. Failed before 15psi
3) Went to Autozone and purchased Duralast 7716, and check with pressure gage. Cap held 16 plus psi.
4) Installed new Duralast cap and started car. Coolant pipes temp changed within 90 seconds but was warm within 150seconds.
5) As suggested verified temp with HVAC controller. Car achieved temp of 102C and fan kicked on as it should. Fan stop running when temp reached 98C. Note, in previous attempts by this time coolant was flowing past radiator cap and analog gauge was well past midpoint.
6) However, with the Duralast cap installed, I noticed coolant leaking around Brass filler neck and the seam of the tank.

In summary it appears my New cap faulty which masked a leak in the plastic tank. Will replace tank and go from there. After a year and 4 months, one day soon I will drive this car.��

[Dynomite]

Okay guys just thought I would provide an update. Before I get started,once again let me thank everyone for the assistance.

1) As suggested verified cap was fastened properly. Went all the way to last notch, no change, but good suggestion.
2) Once car cooled thought I would check New Delco cap 6410962 (Rock Auto)and with pressure tester. New cap would not make it to 17psi as stated on cap. Failed before 15psi
3) Went to Autozone and purchased Duralast 7716, and check with pressure gage. Cap held 16 plus psi.
4) Installed new Duralast cap and started car. Coolant pipes temp changed within 90 seconds but was warm within 150seconds.
5) As suggested verified temp with HVAC controller. Car achieved temp of 102C and fan kicked on as it should. Fan stop running when temp reached 98C. Note, in previous attempts by this time coolant was flowing past radiator cap and analog gauge was well past midpoint.
6) However, with the Duralast cap installed, I noticed coolant leaking around Brass filler neck and the seam of the tank.

In summary it appears my New cap faulty which masked a leak in the plastic tank. Will replace tank and go from there. After a year and 4 months, one day soon I will drive this car.��

I think you solved the immediate issue.......you can get those tanks new for less than $75 or used for as low as $30 on Ebay.

I am thinking the tanks for the ZR-1 are identical to the Standard Corvette Tanks .........maybe :p
I can tell you tomorrow if the tanks are identical if no one else jumps in as I just installed a new Ron Davis Radiator and 195 deg Thermostat in my 1990 (L98) today (will be topping off that coolant overflow tank in morning) ;)

[GOLDCYLON]

I think you solved the immediate issue.......you can get those tanks new for less than $75 or used for as low as $30 on Ebay.

I am thinking the tanks for the ZR-1 are identical to the Standard Corvette Tanks .........

They are identical