Why I Toe/Heel-Heel/Toe

[Tripler]

When in Bowling Green this summer I had the opportunity to take our 1995 ZR-1 out on the BG test track and it was an amazing time . I had real problem though . I was unable to toe/heel in this C4 tho I had no issues in Mark's 620hp modded Zr-1 C4 . I had raced in a C4 more than 20 years ago in the Escort Endurance series and from what I remember I had no issues with toe/heel . What I found a few weeks later was that I had the wrong footwear . This is a very important step when doing T/H . For one thing I never wore a street shoe when racing as they were a Nomex Boot made of a flame proof material and also very pliable with easy movement . Toe/heel is used when you are slowing the car down and downshifting into the next lower gear while also braking smoothly .Recently someone asked my as to why one would toe T/H at all . Well there a few reasons as to why we would , especially in the LT-5 or any standard transmission or engine type for that matter .
First reason being smooth downshifts with very little stress on the drive train . When I raced cars years ago and during pit stops , the crew rarely if ever had to change the break pads when I was driving the car . Reason being that I was very gentle with my breaking and very light footed and that I was also using engine breaking to some point and of course sliding the car slightly to reduce speed coming into a corner . Afore mentioned are difficult skills to learn but with practice they can be mastered but most importantly learning T/H will be your first step into really enjoying a standard transmission in any car , especially the LT5 .

Secondly with the LT5 having all those extra cams up front (wow) when blipping the throttle to my thinking ,is that the oil will rise up to lubricate those 4 beauty's spinning like whirl winds and the intake/exhaust valves hopping up and down like a rabbit on hot coals inside that awesome engine . I recently learned that in my 2003 Concours motorcycle engine
( a double over head cam detuned 1000cc Ninja Motor) that you should keep the revs above 3000 rpm to keep the oil moving to lubricate the cams and valves . Lower rpm's such as long idling are not recommended . So throttle blipping on a motorcycle comes into play here and for good reason . I also thought that that principal would probably apply to the LT5 as well . Ever hear cars or bikes at the racetrack ? What are they doing when the are sitting to be gridded or even just moving to be lined up for a race ? Blipping the throttle ...Irritating as hell actually but it makes sense now .

And thirdly the satisfaction that you are driving this car the way it was meant to be driven . It is not your typical go to the store and get milk car tho you can use it a such . It is meant to be treated as it was designed . A high performance super car which it most certainly is .
Also while in Bowling Green a few of the other ZR-1 car owners were asking me about T/H as they were also having difficulty's with this process . I will be making an instructional video with the help of my daughter who just finished a 3 year stint at college and passed with flying colors in the Media, Arts/Broadcasting program . Right now one of the short films she has worked on will be shown here at TIFF here in TO .
Anyway I digress . I would also like to see a few response on this topic as to why you toe heel or why you do not toe heel .
Do you find it too difficult ?
Do you think you are harming the car ?
Do you think it is a silly process and is not required ?


Personally I find it to be most rewarding when I can get all that power slowed down smoothly and efficiently exactly as it would be done on the race track .

PS ,,, I have toe heeled every car I have owned , cars and bikes , with a standard transmission since I was a kid and never broke a vehicle in anyway and with less wear on the vehicle from the drive train , breaks , wheels , suspension , motor ...

Tripler

;) ;) ;)

[XfireZ51]

Have always wanted to learn how to do this. Whenever I have attempted this, I just find that maintaining my leg/foot in that position is a bit difficult. Perhaps I am missing something. Look forward to the video.

[Paul Workman]

I'm with Dom. I'm aware (and in awe!) of the technique, but never tutored in its execution! Willing to learn tho!!

[RussMcB]

A few thoughts ...

To me, the importance of heel/toe is to prevent loss of traction in the rear while braking/downshifting. If you are on the edge of adhesion, you do not want any abrupt, new force on the rear tires.

A reminder: Downshifting while braking is not to help slow the car. Slowing the car is done 100% with the brakes. The only reason to downshift during braking is to make sure you are in the right gear for accelerating after corner turn-in.

I think heel/toe is fun, and it becomes habit (like everything) with practice. It is difficult, maybe impossible with some pedals. In my '91 I am able to heel/toe when needed. I rarely do it on the street because I am never braking on the limit, even at places like Tail of the Dragon.

Although it is called Heel/Toe, more often than not it is actually using the outside of the foot for gas, and the ball of the foot for braking. The braking is the crucial part. The throttle blip does not need to be as perfect.

[Tripler]

Practice on the street is quite easy . Just break later and do T/H . I do it all the time . Once you get to the track or a slalom , you will already know how to do it and it will be second nature and you won't even have to think about it . Practice is the key here and yes , you can do it easily on the street even if it is only from 4th to 3rd which is the easiest to start out with . Leave lot's of space and distance around other vehicles and you will be fine . A parking lot also is a good place to start .

True all breaking on the track or street should be done in a straight line but every now and then , the help of the engine can come into play if done correctly and should only be attempted if you know how to do it . As Russ said , if done incorrectly , you will get rear wheel lock up or axle hop and under heavy breaking , the rear of the car will become lite and breaking adhesion will be at a minimum but still usable in some instances . You will not have this issue while street driving unless you are hammering the car lol . I have many Championships and Wins under my belt from my younger days so I do have a lot of experience in this matter . I was a very fast guy back in the day ... Now , not so much of course .
I have watched some of you guys drive your cars and I was very impressed but I also saw a lot of people struggling to get all those moves done correctly . Practice is the only word of advice I can offer at this point .
First off try and learn and understand the principals of how T/H works . Other than for learning a new skill or having a smoother ride in the car or just plain fun to listen to that LT5 hum along .Practice rev matching while down shifting and don't worry about the foot breaking part . For instance I drive my car at 40 mph in 4th gear . Depress the clutch and blip the throttle and reach down and shift from 4th to 3rd . I always have my hands on the wheel and once the shift is done , my right hand goes right back to were it was . If you do it correctly , the shift will feel like butter and the car will not jerk or lurch . If it is lurching or chugging then add a larger blip to the pedal and try again . It will not have to be a heavy blip to the throttle or high revs . Don't be staring at your tach , listen to the motor and feel how smooth the shift goes . Practice until you get smooth at that , then once you are proficient in that part of the learning curve , begin trying the foot breaking process along with the blip of the throttle .
Again practice this in a safe location or in light traffic with lot's of distance from other vehicles . I do not want anyone bending there car or hurting themselves during T/H practice .

Once I have the vid completed it will become more clear to you . Also next year at BG I can give some quick tutoring to anyone who is interested . I am very happy to pass on the skills I acquired racing so many years ago ... Also if some of you guys that already know T/H could help with some tutoring at BG next year that would be greatly appreciated to the new guys to this process .
Also footwear is paramount . The runners I wore at BG had a huge side step sticking out and made T/H a real pita ... Better shoes made all the difference . I ended up just blipping and breaking after the shift whilst at the BG track until I got into Marks 620 car which had pro pedals set up for racing and man I wish all the C4's had that pedal setup in Mark's car . What a sweet ride that beast is ...

;)

[dredgeguy]

Wow, can't wait to learn but just a warning, size 11.5 EEE width. With big foot can clutch, break and hit the throttle all at once!:-D

[RussMcB]

Wow, can't wait to learn but just a warning, size 11.5 EEE width. With big foot can clutch, break and hit the throttle all at once!:-DThat's funny.

And if it was a 60's-70's car, you could hit the dimmer switch, too! :-)

[LGAFF]

Wow, can't wait to learn but just a warning, size 11.5 EEE width. With big foot can clutch, break and hit the throttle all at once!:-D

Try it with a 15/16:)

[Fully Vetted]

While I've done it in other cars I've always found the C4 foot well a little tight for this maneuver. If you guys are doing it with no problem it must be the wrong footwear.

[BigJohn]

Wow, can't wait to learn but just a warning, size 11.5 EEE width. With big foot can clutch, break and hit the throttle all at once!:-D

I have the same problem, especially with the Modern tennis shoes!

[ghlkal]

While I've done it in other cars I've always found the C4 foot well a little tight for this maneuver.


I find that I have to wear my Piloti's when driving the Z. If I wear "regular" shoes, I'm hitting all the wrong pedals :p


I'm no expert at heel and toe, but this thread has reminded me there's no reason I can't practice it when driving around.

[efnfast]

I've tried, and the gas and brake are so far apart, I don't know how I could twist my foot around to be on both pedals at the same time.

[BigJohn]

I've tried, and the gas and brake are so far apart, I don't know how I could twist my foot around to be on both pedals at the same time.

Twist your leg not your foot!
:cheers:

[Tripler]

Great responses guys . As a few have mentioned it is not exactly toe/heel or heel/toe . You are rolling the right side of your foot onto the gas pedal and in the C4 , it's a super pain with the wrong shoes but much easier with the correct footwear . Also your right foot will not be flat on the brake pedal . It will be on either the side or the top corner of the brake pedal . That positioning is why I stated that you practice this with lots of room in front of and around you . If your foot slides off that brake pedal while you are only gracing the edge of the brake pedal with your foot , then things can go wrong real quick when your foot lands on the gas pedal . Trust me . This will happen your first few tries and it will be friggin frustrating but keep at it . Don't give up .
Here is another trick I learned with the C4 . If as some of you have stated that your foot size is verging on a pro basketball players then you may be able to do this . My shoe size is only 10 but I have flat feet so they are kind of wide .
Put your heel on the break pedal or center of your foot instead of your regular way of applying which would probably be your toes . Then twist the top of your foot to the right and you will feel the lever that is the gas pedal . It will not be the gas pedal but your toes will be feeling the plastic lever that holds the gas pedal . You can actually blip the throttle with this method . Be gentle tho as they have been known to break . Plastic . Really GM !
Try it in your driveway engine running or off , hand break on , and do as I just stated and see if you can maneuver your right foot to do the breaking and blip of the throttle . I did it with mine and it will feel really weird not having your foot on that little rubber gas pedal but you can apply throttle by just pushing the plastic lever with your toes . Give it a shot and let me know how it went . I will take some stills and post them here tonight so you can see what I am doing and hopefully you guys with basketball feet can succeed in a T/H maneuver . Again try this in the driveway first then in a clear spot roadway and I also highly recommend that your hand break functions perfectly . You never know when your gonna need it but when you do need it , it will save your butt ... Trust me on that .
Also if you guys really want to see a vehicle that is difficult to T/H in with large feet is a Formula Car . Non synchronize transmissions , H pattern super short shifts and absolutely no room between the pedals plus your shoulders are being squeezed inward against the fuselage . Good thing about it is the pedals are setup up for easy T/H , just very tight quarters . The steering wheel is ridiculously small and you sit with your butt a few inches off the road . But what a hell of a lot of fun and I was lucky enough to drive one on a rainy day . Now that is exciting ,,, wow ... I never raced open wheel as it really never interested me . I prefer the feel of a chunk of metal around me or fiberglass in the Z's case .
My goal as a driver was to eventually race in a Group C car such as Derek Bell drove but I never made it that far up the ladder . But you need lots of money and lots of sponsors and they were very hard to find in Canada .
Good luck with your T/H ...

Mike

[Bob Eyres]

I've tried it a few times, to no great success. But it would be fun to get some expert instruction. Sign me up for next year at BG :cheers:

I used most of my misspent youth and reflexes trying to get the most out of a four speed at the drag strip. Which is an art in itself.

The new rev-matching feature on Corvettes allows untalented pedal dancers like most of us to mimic the smooth action of heel & toe. Tripler, have you tried one of those?
My wife's 335i has the Tiptronic auto that does a similar blip. Fun to play with.

[Tripler]

Never drove the new cars but it amazes me the technology installed in every day cars which come initially from the race track and now obviously on high end performance vehicles . Cool ...
Drag racing is an art indeed . Getting your launch and shift points done correctly and consistently must be a pig to accomplish ... ;)
I have no experience with drag racing ...

;)

;)

[RussMcB]

Thanks a lot, Mike. I should be working, but this thread has provoked fun thoughts.<snip> Non synchronize transmissions ...Interestingly, this actually makes matching the RPM's and getting into the next gear surprisingly easy. In fact, with the racing transaxles in most formula cars the clutch is only used on pit road, and not for up or downshifting. I'm sure many of you are motorcycle riders and don't use the clutch for upshifts. It just "snicks" into gear. A great feeling.

Similar to Heel/Toe, Left Foot Braking (LFB) is popular in formula cars (since the left foot isn't needed for clutching on track). It also takes a bit getting used to, but helps for a smoother transition from braking to accelerating, and the right foot is used for gas only (no Heel/Toe). I couldn't LFB in my last car because the steering column was in the way.

Racing formula cars is (I guess) like heroin. SO different than door slammers (and karts, too, because of the suspension). I can still remember in my first race car watching the front tire, only a couple of feet away, moving with the curbing.

[Tripler]

Thanks a lot, Mike. I should be working, but this thread has provoked fun thoughts.Interestingly, this actually makes matching the RPM's and getting into the next gear surprisingly easy. In fact, with the racing transaxles in most formula cars the clutch is only used on pit road, and not for up or downshifting. I'm sure many of you are motorcycle riders and don't use the clutch for upshifts. It just "snicks" into gear. A great feeling.

Similar to Heel/Toe, Left Foot Braking (LFB) is popular in formula cars (since the left foot isn't needed for clutching on track). It also takes a bit getting used to, but helps for a smoother transition from braking to accelerating, and the right foot is used for gas only (no Heel/Toe). I couldn't LFB in my last car because the steering column was in the way.

Racing formula cars is (I guess) like heroin. SO different than door slammers (and karts, too, because of the suspension). I can still remember in my first race car watching the front tire, only a couple of feet away, moving with the curbing.


Awesome Russ !. So you raced those open wheel thingys . I agree they are a completely different animal than any thing you will ever experience but I prefer that closed in feeling . Question . From what I remember in the open wheel Formula Ford I drove , we still toe heeled on down shifts . I did depress the clutch on upshifts lifting throttle slightly . Is that how it is done ? I know on my bike I rarely if ever use the clutch for upshifts put I blip the throttle and use the clutch for downshifts, tho occasionally I can downshift without the clutch ...You have to be careful and have no load on the engine or the drive train .

Thanks

[Mystic ZR-1]

Left foot braking...
Done that for years in all automatics I've ever driven.
When I was 16 or so, I read some place that Jim Hall
drove the Chapparal that way.
Good enough for Jim Hall? Good enough for me!
Two feet, two pedals...
Don't know what a Chapparal is? (youngster...)
Google it...
:)

[Tripler]

Not a fan of left foot braking on the street but it works like a charm on the track when you get a bit of under steer in a corner ...

;)

[8cam]

Yep it's really just using the ball of your foot on the brake, and rocking it over to the accelerator pedal for a blip when needed. I do it on every single downshift, every time I drive anywhere. It's like breathing, totally unconscious, and I'm not sure I could unlearn the habit.

Here's how it's done, from one of the best who ever lived. In loafers!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lo5wDmJGYGo

[RussMcB]

Awesome Russ !. So you raced those open wheel thingys . Yes. Still do. I left OW briefly for Spec Miata in 2014-2015 (and really enjoyed it), but I'm back to OW, working on a project for the 2017 season.Question . From what I remember in the open wheel Formula Ford I drove , we still toe heeled on down shifts . I did depress the clutch on upshifts lifting throttle slightly . Is that how it is done ? I can't make a blanket statement because cars and drivers are so different (and transaxles), but most formula racers I know do not use the clutch after leaving the pits (for up or downshifts). You do need to either Heel/Toe or LFB during braking if a downshift is involved, because a throttle blip is definitely needed to match RPM's. LFB is only needed/used if you downshift without a clutch.

[Tripler]

I know the Indy cars had sequential transmission so it was just push forward for up and pull back for down . Imsa cars had that also I believe . Fomula 1 have padels but that may also be the case with Indy cars and many other race cars of today .



Sent from my LG-D852 using ZR-1 Net Registry mobile app (http://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=90383)

[tf95ZR1]

Here's how it's done, from one of the best who ever lived. In loafers!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lo5wDmJGYGo

Awesome video, 8cam! Very helpful with a "pedal camera." I also noticed
that Senna "blips" the throttle through turns (not for shifting). Probably maximizing speed/grip through the corners. I like it!

[RussMcB]

Another thing that's common with sequential transmissions is assisted "no lift" shifters - electronic solenoids or air powered. They are really impressive. A sensor tells the programmable computer when the upshift is initiated and it cuts the ignition. It all happens really fast and the driver just keeps the gas pedal to the floor (no lift, no clutch). I'm pretty sure all top level racing has that now (F1, P1, etc.), and lower levels. Probably every Formula SAE team has them.

My current project is (will be) Suzuki Hayabusa powered, and I considered a Flatshifter or something similar, but I enjoy the ole timey manual shifting.

[BigJohn]

Left foot braking...
Done that for years in all automatics I've ever driven.
When I was 16 or so, I read some place that Jim Hall
drove the Chapparal that way.
Good enough for Jim Hall? Good enough for me!
Two feet, two pedals...
Don't know what a Chapparal is? (youngster...)
Google it...
:)

So you got your bicycle out???

[Mystic ZR-1]

could never figure it out?
Jim Hall never called me to drive?

[nelson007]

I saw a picture of Jim Hall from 1967 in a Chaparral at the Nürburgring track a few weeks ago.
Nelson

could never figure it out?
Jim Hall never called me to drive?

[BigJohn]

could never figure it out?
Jim Hall never called me to drive?

I let you drive my car!

:neutral:

[Tripler]

So I took a few pics of foot placement on the pedals with 2 different shoes that I wear when I drive .
This first pair are super comfortable and offer toe protection which I like a lot with my walking skills . They are also flexible which is an important step to applying T/H maneuvers . As you can see the foot is angled towards the gas pedal and I am actually pressing the top of the gas pedal and the side of the brake pedal . This is one way that should work for you guys with basketball feet . You will have to extend your foot forward like a ballerina to blip the throttle . It does not have to go right to the floor board . Just listen to the revs and do your downshift . If it went smoothly then your blipping pressure was correct . If not then you have to apply a deeper POINT of your toe . That is ballerina talk for making your foot straight out from your leg . Bet you didn't guess you would get dancing lessons here too lol .

http://i979.photobucket.com/albums/ae272/Triplerocket/20160720_163409_HDR_zpsfo75oxch.jpg (http://s979.photobucket.com/user/Triplerocket/media/20160720_163409_HDR_zpsfo75oxch.jpg.html)



http://i979.photobucket.com/albums/ae272/Triplerocket/20160720_163445_HDR%201_zps0ghvwa40.jpg (http://s979.photobucket.com/user/Triplerocket/media/20160720_163445_HDR%201_zps0ghvwa40.jpg.html)

And here is with my running shoes . Again they fit snug but the laces are loose and the runner is flexible . A stiff shoe bottom will not work so fancy go out to dinner or office shoes or anything with a heel are not recommended .So no KISS boot's ! Place the edge of the running shoe on the brake pedal as you see in the first pic . As you can see in the 2nd pic I am stretching my toe forward and making my foot straight with my leg, called pointing in dance talk and blip the throttle . Do this in the driveway first with the engine off and see if your feet and placement of your feet will let you press the brake pedal and the gas at the same time . That is what you are trying to accomplish here . Using one foot to control 2 pedals . If you feel you had enough practice and are able to blip and brake then head out on the road and give it a try . Again do this in a safe location with lots of runoff area and no other cars or pedestrians around you . Just try 4th to 3rd as they are the easiest to shift . You rarely if ever would be going from 2nd to 1st but you will be doing 3rd to 2nd on a track or on the street when you become proficient at T/H

;)

http://i979.photobucket.com/albums/ae272/Triplerocket/20160720_163606_HDR_zpsmaq1yiai.jpg (http://s979.photobucket.com/user/Triplerocket/media/20160720_163606_HDR_zpsmaq1yiai.jpg.html)

http://i979.photobucket.com/albums/ae272/Triplerocket/20160720_163738_HDR_zpsoi2cdeij.jpg (http://s979.photobucket.com/user/Triplerocket/media/20160720_163738_HDR_zpsoi2cdeij.jpg.html)

[Tripler]

Yep it's really just using the ball of your foot on the brake, and rocking it over to the accelerator pedal for a blip when needed. I do it on every single downshift, every time I drive anywhere. It's like breathing, totally unconscious, and I'm not sure I could unlearn the habit.

Here's how it's done, from one of the best who ever lived. In loafers!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lo5wDmJGYGo


I don't think I saw him break once with his left foot . Correct me if I am wrong . Also I love the way he was blipping that throttle through the corners on coast mode trying to see how much understeer or addhesion the car can handle .

;)

[A26B]

I think the blips in the corner are deliberate to induce oversteer to get around the corner faster as opposed to light braking.
A light quick blip will accelerate momentarily and then on engine decel, shift car balance with more weight on the front wheels to increase traction & turn in better.... all without slowing the car.

[Tripler]

Here are a few pics of my race boot's . Lost of dust on these buggers . As you can see the bottom of the shoe is actually quite smooth and a little slippery to the touch as to not stick on the rubber if the pedals do have rubber . They are also very very flexible and toasty warm when in a hot race car . I have not driven with these on yet in the Z .

http://i979.photobucket.com/albums/ae272/Triplerocket/20160721_090956_HDR_zps07dsri8c.jpg (http://s979.photobucket.com/user/Triplerocket/media/20160721_090956_HDR_zps07dsri8c.jpg.html)

http://i979.photobucket.com/albums/ae272/Triplerocket/20160721_091012_HDR_zpslqsfefbr.jpg (http://s979.photobucket.com/user/Triplerocket/media/20160721_091012_HDR_zpslqsfefbr.jpg.html)

[Tripler]

I think the blips in the corner are deliberate to induce oversteer to get around the corner faster as opposed to light braking.
A light quick blip will accelerate momentarily and then on engine decel, shift car balance with more weight on the front wheels to increase traction & turn in better.... all without slowing the car.

Exactly . You were able to explain it better than me . Back in the day a lot of drivers talked of using the left foot breaking to create that effect while also still on the throttle . I preferred the way Senna did it and I never left foot braked in corners to reduce under steer tho I do now in my racing simulator in rFactor2 . Sim racing is beyond difficult and I most certainly enjoy the real thing over the sim any day tho the sim gives me that thrill still to some extent .

Thanks Russ and A26B for your input ...

;)

[ZR1North]

Great thread, guys, and very good idea to include a heel and toe segment in next years's Gathering. When I went to Fellows school a couple of years ago, they spent about two hours one morning teaching the technique and allowing us to practice it on the C7. The next day, they turned on the rev-match feature and I was left wishing I could add this to our Zees. The manual process is like magic when you get it right, but quite frustrating when you miss it. I am still learning.

[Tripler]

If you practice as often as you can each time you are in the car it will become second nature and you won't even think about it . Your right foot will automatically flip on its side and blip the throttle while the ball of your right foot is braking at the same time . Don't worry about getting smooth at this point . Foot placement is the most important first were you find that location that suits you and it just feels right . It's the feeling that your foot will not slip off the brake pedal while you are blipping the throttle . It is a very specific location and getting it on the mark every single time will take practice . When I first started racing in my 1983 Honda Civic in the Honda Michelin Series I was rough as hell , missing T/H often and probably a lot of over revved engine . But by the 4th or 5th race I was starting to get it and could stay right on the tail of the lead car . In fact , I did that all summer long . I never passed him . He told me that I could pass him many times but I told him I was learning and was fine following a very good driver . By doing this and not trying to win right out of the box I taught myself how to be smooth and fast at the same time . By the end of the summer with 2 races to go I let out the lions and smoked by my mentor watching him loose distance from me in my mirrors . The lesson here is that you will not be able to master something right off the bat . Take your time . That was the key for me . It was basically an extended all summer long driving course that I programmed into my brain and it worked out very well for me . 1984 I won Regional Champion for Ontario in a show room stock vehicle in my 1983 Honda Civic . The next year ,1985 ,I won The Honda Michelin Series and 4 different Mini Series Championships in Ontario and Quebec . I also won the National Cup in my 1985 Honda Civic that same summer . I had over 50 competitors to do battle with on the circuits . So that whole summer of 1983 following a fast driver in regional event's paid off big time .
The next year I did the Players Challenge in the 1986 Camaro and finished 2nd overall with more than 70 competitors . It was a huge switch from a 60hp front wheel drive car to a I think 200 hp rear drive tank of a car . But I adapted . Tho I only usually finished in the top 5/got pole position once , and even got a fourth a few times , I was consistent. That was key . I finished every race I have ever started in my 9 years of racing . I do not think there is another driver that can attest to that . I had a serious crash once and wrote off a car but it was not my race and it was not the main event race so I basically never started the main event . Fatigue caused that accident . Never be tired and go racing . You may as well drink a case of beer and go flying . Same principal . Anyway I always had to finish a race no matter how bad things were . I went from fourth on the grid once to 40th one race with a smashed up car and drove my way up to 17th in a 20 lap race . Another time I had an air pump explode in the IROC and I went backwards down the grid during the race with an engine with half its power . I did not pit . I stayed on the track . Eventually the eprom reprogrammed the engine to run without the airpump and I got my power back . I passed 20 cars in a very short time and finished 7th from almost dead last . I never gave up and many other people and drivers told that to me many times and I would just smile and say thank you . I had drilled that into my head that very first summer of learning to race in 1983 . Finish the race . That's what its all about is it not ? Going fast and crashing does not prove anything other than adding a lot of expense to your hobby and even injury to your self and others . You must drive clean ...smoothly...
Ok ,,, back to T/H which is one of the first steps that you should learn if you really want to enjoy your vehicle . Remember also that some drivers will get it quickly and others will not . Just try to be patient . First just practice gear matching for now . 4th gear , 40 mph , blip the throttle and throw it into 3rd . It should just slide into third and the car will not lurch . Smooth like butter . Just listen to that responsive LT5 and if that does not give you goose bumps every time you blip the throttle , then your in the wrong car , but I know you will have goose bumps and when it goes smoothly , you will also have a huge smile ...
Again . Practice in a safe location as always ...

;) ;) ;)

[8cam]

Also notice how Senna shifts. No power shifting, slamming, speed shifting, just a deliberate movement timed perfectly to balance the car. That kind of smooth driving style is what makes cars last, and wins races. I know I'm probably in the minority here, but I don't like drag racing and watching someone power shift is like mechanical abuse. Watching Senna drive that NSX on a road course, probably faster in loafers than anyone else in full gear, is watching an artist at work.

[RussMcB]

I remember reading a long time ago something by Mario Andretti about the importance of "mechanical sympathy". That phrase has been stuck in my head for decades.

[Tripler]

Hopefully this link works . I did just a run through video last week with the car not running . It is unedited . I hope this gives you guys and gals an idea of were your feet should roughly be when doing T/H . I give 2 examples that work . One with the side of your foot and one with your toe and center of foot on the brake . That may work for you basketball guys ...I was a little surprised as to how difficult it was when I was not in motion . It took a few moments for my brain to put everything into context as you will see in the video lol . I never did T/H while not moving before but I figured it out . Don't worry about shifting gears when you are not in motion .
After you feel comfortable with you foot placement , start the engine (handbrake on) and press the brake and see if you can blip the throttle and rev the engine . Be gentle . You do not need high revs to accomplish T/H unless you are on the track racing at much higher speeds then what we are doing here which is everyday street or highway driving .
Now head out and find a safe place and try it out . Hopefully you have already practiced gear matching on downshifts that I mentioned earlier so you should have a good idea as to what the engine will sound like for a T/H maneuver when blipping the throttle . Again , you don't need to be staring at the tachometer . It is all about feel and sound . It should all be smooth . Breaking lightly , blip throttle , downshift , and back to throttle with right foot and with left foot back to deadstop position as you see in the video . Note ! Never rest your foot on the clutch . Be close to it when about to shift but do not touch it until you are ready to shift .

And most importantly ,,,have fun !!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTFJSftU8eQ

[Fully Vetted]

I've always done it the 2nd way. Just seemed more natural.

[Tripler]

Interesting. I have always done it the first way but I can see how the second way works well for some people. The trick is applying steady smooth breaking with the middle of your foot while also stretching your toe forward to blip the throttle. Either will work with lots of practice ... I think in a larger spaced vehicle you might even be able to actually put your toe on the brake and blip the throttle with your heel as the phrase Toe/ heel suggests. I believe that's a tough one to do in a C4 ...
I will try tomorrow and let you know ...

;)



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[Tripler]

When in Bowling Green this summer I had the opportunity to take our 1995 ZR-1 out on the BG test track and it was an amazing time . I had real problem though . I was unable to toe/heel in this C4 tho I had no issues in Mark's 620hp modded Zr-1 C4 . I had raced in a C4 more than 20 years ago in the Escort Endurance series and from what I remember I had no issues with toe/heel . What I found a few weeks later was that I had the wrong footwear . This is a very important step when doing T/H . For one thing I never wore a street shoe when racing as they were a Nomex Boot made of a flame proof material and also very pliable with easy movement . Toe/heel is used when you are slowing the car down and downshifting into the next lower gear while also braking smoothly .Recently someone asked my as to why one would toe T/H at all . Well there a few reasons as to why we would , especially in the LT-5 or any standard transmission or engine type for that matter .
First reason being smooth downshifts with very little stress on the drive train . When I raced cars years ago and during pit stops , the crew rarely if ever had to change the break pads when I was driving the car . Reason being that I was very gentle with my breaking and very light footed and that I was also using engine breaking to some point and of course sliding the car slightly to reduce speed coming into a corner . Afore mentioned are difficult skills to learn but with practice they can be mastered but most importantly learning T/H will be your first step into really enjoying a standard transmission in any car , especially the LT5 .

Secondly with the LT5 having all those extra cams up front (wow) when blipping the throttle to my thinking ,is that the oil will rise up to lubricate those 4 beauty's spinning like whirl winds and the intake/exhaust valves hopping up and down like a rabbit on hot coals inside that awesome engine . I recently learned that in my 2003 Concours motorcycle engine
( a double over head cam detuned 1000cc Ninja Motor) that you should keep the revs above 3000 rpm to keep the oil moving to lubricate the cams and valves . Lower rpm's such as long idling are not recommended . So throttle blipping on a motorcycle comes into play here and for good reason . I also thought that that principal would probably apply to the LT5 as well . Ever hear cars or bikes at the racetrack ? What are they doing when the are sitting to be gridded or even just moving to be lined up for a race ? Blipping the throttle ...Irritating as hell actually but it makes sense now .

And thirdly the satisfaction that you are driving this car the way it was meant to be driven . It is not your typical go to the store and get milk car tho you can use it a such . It is meant to be treated as it was designed . A high performance super car which it most certainly is .
Also while in Bowling Green a few of the other ZR-1 car owners were asking me about T/H as they were also having difficulty's with this process . I will be making an instructional video with the help of my daughter who just finished a 3 year stint at college and passed with flying colors in the Media, Arts/Broadcasting program . Right now one of the short films she has worked on will be shown here at TIFF here in TO .
Anyway I digress . I would also like to see a few response on this topic as to why you toe heel or why you do not toe heel .
Do you find it too difficult ?
Do you think you are harming the car ?
Do you think it is a silly process and is not required ?


Personally I find it to be most rewarding when I can get all that power slowed down smoothly and efficiently exactly as it would be done on the race track .

PS ,,, I have toe heeled every car I have owned , cars and bikes , with a standard transmission since I was a kid and never broke a vehicle in anyway and with less wear on the vehicle from the drive train , breaks , wheels , suspension , motor ...

Tripler

;) ;) ;)



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[Fully Vetted]

Interesting. I have always done it the first way but I can see how the second way works well for some people. The trick is applying steady smooth breaking with the middle of your foot while also stretching your toe forward to blip the throttle. Either will work with lots of practice ... I think in a larger spaced vehicle you might even be able to actually put your toe on the brake and blip the throttle with your heel as the phrase Toe/ heel suggests. I believe that's a tough one to do in a C4 ...
I will try tomorrow and let you know ...

;)



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I was never taught how to do it. I just figured that was the way it was done.

[RussMcB]

PS ,,, I have toe heeled every car I have owned , cars and bikes , with a standard transmission since I was a kid and never broke a vehicle in anyway and with less wear on the vehicle from the drive train , breaks , wheels , suspension , motor ...I'm looking forward to your detailed description of toe/heeling on bikes. :-)

[Tripler]

I'm looking forward to your detailed description of toe/heeling on bikes. :-)
Me too ;-)

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[Tripler]

Actually you do a hell of a lot of toe and heel when riding a bike tho not like a car of course . Your heel is on the peg and your toes are either working the rear brake or shifter. So the phrase toe / heel really does apply to a motorcycle as well .
;-)

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[Tripler]

Oh and yes . There are bikes with automatic transmission in case you were wondering . Google it .
;-)

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[Tripler]

I've tried, and the gas and brake are so far apart, I don't know how I could twist my foot around to be on both pedals at the same time.
Steve . Try placing your foot to the side of the edge of the brake pedal. Your right foot will then be much closer to the gas pedal . Practice braking this way first . Also you right foot should also be twisting a little to the right . Perhaps pigeon toed would be the correct posture ... Practice that foot placement first and see if you can get smooth safe braking first before you try a throttle blip and T/H ...

:-)

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[Hog]

I remember watching races from the 80's which involves 80's turbo technology (small displacement lotsa turbo-lag) and this would force the guys to stay on the accelerator and the brake at the same time in an attempt to keep the engine loaded therefore the turbo spooled as best as possible. Certainly different than driving a N/A car.

[Tripler]

I remember watching races from the 80's which involves 80's turbo technology (small displacement lotsa turbo-lag) and this would force the guys to stay on the accelerator and the brake at the same time in an attempt to keep the engine loaded therefore the turbo spooled as best as possible. Certainly different than driving a N/A car.
Aahhh. So I guess that's were the left foot braking would be used in circuit racing . Interesting . Never raced in a turbo car .
;)

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[RussMcB]

The "keep the turbo spooled up" explanation makes sense, especially in a corner that requires braking but not a downshift. I guess that would be true for a NA car, too.

I think the other (or main) reason LFB was 'invented" is because it takes less time to transition from braking to accelerating. You can start squeezing the gas while the left foot is still over the brake pedal.

When I first started LFB'ing I felt like it helped me manage the weight transfer of the car (by overlapping the pressure on the two pedals), but I was probably kidding myself and only wearing my brake pads faster and over heating the brakes unnecessarily. :-)