newbie

[tyler11]

Hello All,

I now own a 91 non running zr1 (timing chain) and will have many future questions but the first is about the VATS system.

I have read the threads on the VATS and disabling it and such but it seems that you need to have the key and the code in order to do that (which is my problem).

I do not have the ignition key (never had it) and the dealership could not pull my vats code even with the VIN number. They claim that I bring the car in and they have to go through each resistance and see which one it is.

The steering wheel was locked straight when I got it (made it quite fun to load it on a trailer when you cant turn the front wheels, but now it would be nice to be able to move it in case I need to.

Will any code (resistance) key unlock the steering wheel as long as it is made to my VIN?

Or is there any other way to get the Vats code form GM without the car being in?

I look forward to getting to know yall and trying to get this car running as soon as I can!!

Name is Tyler, and I am in Austin, Tx.

[Dynomite]

Hello All,
I now own a 91 non running zr1 (timing chain).
Name is Tyler, and I am in Austin, Tx.

Welcome Tyler :handshak:

When you say timing chain.....what exactly are you talking about?

A. Timing Chains.
There is the single Primary Timing Chain (driven by a sprocket on the Crankshaft) and two Secondary Timing Chains/sprockets (driven by the Primary Timing Chain). These two Secondary Timing Chains drive the four Camshafts (each Secondary Timing Chain of different length driving the single Intake and single Exhaust Camshafts on each side). Each Camshaft having 8 lobes pushing on 8 lifters and 8 valves stems (4 Primary and 4 Secondary). Total 32 Valves (16 Intake and 16 Exhaust). The Secondary Timing Chains are lubricated from an Oil Port in the Dual Secondary Timing Chain Sprocket which Oil Port is Pressurized (Oil Pressure). That Pressurized Oil is slung around within the Timing Chain Cover Lubricating the Secondary as well as the Primary Timing Chains. It is Very Important to make sure that small Oil Port in the Dual Secondary Timing Chain Sprocket is Open and Functional.

B. Chain Guides.
Associated with the Two Secondary Timing Chains are two each Chain Guides for Each Secondary Timing Chain. One Chain Guide can rotate while the other chain guide is stationary. There is a third Chain Guide located in the top of each Cam Cover also that has been known to rarely fail. The Passenger Side Top Chain Guide is most prone to rarely fail but easy to see pending failure through the Oil Fill Port. The Primary Chain also has a chain Guide/Adjuster that can wear over time but such normal wear does not seem to cause any issues.

Timing Chain and Chain Guide Failures.
I have only heard of two Failures of Secondary Timing Chains and both Failures were difficult to isolate the Cause.
Chain Guide Wear proceeds with two groves from the Chain Links. Once the Chain Rollers come into contact with the Guides, the wear of the Chain Guides is extremely slow (Changing Oil Regularly will actually "for all practical purposes" stop chain guide wear almost completely). The Engine has to be removed to change out Timing Chains and/or Chain Guides. The Cam Cover Top Chain Guide can be changed out with engine in car by removing the Cam Covers (not easy but there is a trick to everything related to the LT5) :D

See Secondary Chain Guide Rattle (http://www.corvetteforum.com/forums/c4-zr-1-discussion/3005470-tech-info-lt5-modifications-rebuild-tricks-500-hp-9.html#post1588412798)

Cliff

[Corvettes White]

First, welcome to the Brotherhood. I lost my key in Las Vegas. '89. Cassino parking lot. Locksmith pulled the column and put in a new cylinder, then tried to start the car with different resistors each time. Took a bit of time, because if you tried the wrong resistor the system would time out. After the 5 or 6 try he found the right one. Got home and found my keys at the bottom of my briefcase. George

[WVZR-1]

Hello All,


Will any code (resistance) key unlock the steering wheel as long as it is made to my VIN?


Name is Tyler, and I am in Austin, Tx.

If the dealer was able to retrieve the "mechanical" code for the keys have them cut you a "work key" or take the code to a lock-smith and ask him to do the same. That will enable you to unlock the column so long as nothing has changed. It would also confirm the code is correct.

GM work key part # 26007687 - that is a brass key with no resistance. Very inexpensive and most dealers should have it.

If the mechanical key works there are different possibilities for VATS retrieval. Call a couple local lock-smiths and see if they might consider renting a VATS INTEROGATOR. You could consider maybe using a potentiometer to create your own of sorts but that sometimes creates it's own set of issues. A 10K is very inexpensive and will do all except the #15 resistance which is 11800.

[tyler11]

4652

4653

I am still trying to gather information on the car. It had/has the 368 package from Vette Doctors in NY.

Car was/is in pieces when I got it, down to the crank. I am wanting to do as much as I can myself to get it back together for the experience but any rough idea of what it would set me back labor wise ($$) to get the engine drop-in ready (not including the parts I have to buy)?

Would it be more cost effective to find a used LT5 (although I prefer and want the 368)?

The hardest part about all this is going to be putting something back together that I didn't take apart. I bought the corvette manual and the LT5 supplement.

thanks again in advance

tyler

[Dynomite]

4652

4653

I am still trying to gather information on the car. It had/has the 368 package from Vette Doctors in NY.

Car was/is in pieces when I got it, down to the crank. I am wanting to do as much as I can myself to get it back together for the experience but any rough idea of what it would set me back labor wise ($$) to get the engine drop-in ready (not including the parts I have to buy)?

Would it be more cost effective to find a used LT5 (although I prefer and want the 368)?

The hardest part about all this is going to be putting something back together that I didn't take apart. I bought the corvette manual and the LT5 supplement.

thanks again in advance

tyler

We have to know what else is broke and how it got in this predicament. You need a guy who can put this back together without the manual or supplement if you know what I mean :handshak:

How did the Timing Chain/chains break?
Did someone take it apart and then give up?

[bdw18_123]

Car was/is in pieces when I got it, down to the crank. I am wanting to do as much as I can myself to get it back together for the experience but any rough idea of what it would set me back labor wise ($$) to get the engine drop-in ready (not including the parts I have to buy)?

...

The hardest part about all this is going to be putting something back together that I didn't take apart. I bought the corvette manual and the LT5 supplement.

Sounds a lot like the '90 ZR-1 I had when I first got it off of ebay. It was in similar shape. Though on mine, the engine wasn't completely apart down to the crank, but the whole front end of the engine was completely in pieces. It also had a broken timing chain. At the very least you are going to have some bent valves that will need replacing, but if the chain broke at a higher rpm, could be worse.

Mine broke at a very low rpm, so a few bent valves and some scoring on the top of the oil pump was the worst of the damage on mine. I did have one bad cylinder liner as well, but that was related to coolant/water sitting it in for a long time which damaged the nikasil coating.

I detailed my restoration efforts on the car and the LT5 here; lots of pictures. Here's the link to my restore thread if you want to get a feel for what you are getting into:

http://www.zr1.net/forum/showthread.php?t=9693

[FU]

Call Corey he is one of the best in the business.
http://www.hendersonperformance.com/

[ZRXMAX]

Buy a set of wheel dollies and put the car anywhere you want. A slight modification might be required for the rear wheels to fit inside. It just depends on which ones you find in your area or online.

[tyler11]

"You need a guy who can put this back together without the manual or supplement if you know what I mean"

that sounds like about a $5k or $6K sentence!!

My brother "worked/interned" with Corey for a couple summers. It just seems like a quote from him is gonna be a hefty price, but maybe I am wrong. Anyone have a ballpark? 1K? 3K? 5K? 10k? My brother thought he would be pretty backed up too (time-wise).

How many "hours" do you think the book quotes for LT5 assembly?

Ben, I have read your rebuild threads multiple times, that is so awesome and a really good job. I might make that my new manual!!

My thoughts are to get this drive-able first and then slowly clean inside and whatnot while I can enjoy driving it.

[A26B]

A personal observation over the last several years, regarding the LT5.

Over the last several years, I have furnished a lot of LT5 parts to the full spectrum of mechanical skills. This engine can bite you in the rear if you do not have the experience or read, comprehend & follow the LT5 service manual, which can be difficult to follow. Not all details are covered.

Just one example: Oil pan gasket leak evolved into a full engine overhaul with bent valves, broken pistons, scored cylinders, broken camshafts, etc.

What starts out as a save money, do-it-yourself project can turn out just the opposite.

This is not to say it cannot be done. Many ZR-1 owners have successfully made major repairs, but it is best done with close guidance and a full awareness of the critical steps.

You may consider getting everything together that is needed, fully cleaned, painted & inspected for Corey to assemble. Prep is a major part of the cost that could be saved.

Depending on the parts required for your engine, the cost can still be significant. Just a WAG, but I would expect minimum of $2000~$3000, plus labor as needed. Taking a lot of photos & describing the condition will net you a lot of help here on the forum.

[LGAFF]

that was not a chain failure on that 91 it was Jeal cam failure if this is a White 91 368 off ebay

[bdw18_123]

that was not a chain failure on that 91 it was Jeal cam failure if this is a White 91 368 off ebay

Yeah, I was wondering if it was that car too. I saw that one on ebay (had grey interior) and was contemplating buying it and I had even a convo with the seller via ebay messages. But decided against it.

[tyler11]

Yup, same car. Was my brothers, he bought it, whatever broke...broke. He took it apart to fix and then life happened, married, finished school, moved and now I have it. I contacted Corey this week. Going to start cleaning parts, have Corey inspect, separate the sheep and the goats and go from there.

tyler