Raptor and Henderson Performance

[RHanselman]

All,

FYI - Corey Henderson and I are working on a joint Turbo Project.

Owner: Ron Bidwell
Car: 1990 ZR-1 with 368 CI and Phase 1 CAM's
Turbo System: Raptor Remote Mount
ECM: Raptor

Car has been delivered to Henderson Performance and work will begin by the end of the month. Engine compression is to be lowered and stock CAM's installed. Jerry's Gaskets will be utilized. Turbo system will be provided by Raptor and modified by Henderson Performance to include a custom Inter-Cooler. A new Raptor ECM will be installed as well.

I will keep you posted with updates as we progress...

Cheers,
Ron Hanselman

[gbrtng]

I'll be watching with interest ... Now you need a volunteer with a stock car to outfit.

[tf95ZR1]

Good luck with the project!
Can't wait to see/hear.

[Paul Workman]

On the edge of my seat! I may be moving back to Colorado some day, and @ 8550 AMSL, NA really pays a price!

Good luck!

P.

[RHanselman]

I'll be watching with interest ... Now you need a volunteer with a stock car to outfit.

Here's the stock motor (twin turbo 4-5 psi) dyno sheet. It was my '91 before lowering the compression...

http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m578/rhanselman/img001.jpg

[efnfast]

Stock motor, 475 hp?

[Locobob]

Stock motor, 475 hp?

Pretty sure he means stock motor with turbo kit.

This looks very interesting. What kind of power are you expecting to get out of this Ron?

[USAFPILOT]

think he has a 368 according to the op

[RHanselman]

Stock motor, 475 hp?

Stock motor on 4-5 psi of boost...

[RHanselman]

Pretty sure he means stock motor with turbo kit.

This looks very interesting. What kind of power are you expecting to get out of this Ron?

600+ at the tires. My 374 ci is 613 rwhp on 8 psi

[Corbusa]

Flood us with info and pictures please..

[RHanselman]

Flood us with info and pictures please..

That's the plan ;)

[RHanselman]

Anyone else want to join in the fun? I have 8 Twin Turbo systems remaining. :)

[C4Fanatic]

Anyone else want to join in the fun? I have 8 systems left. :)

After watching your's walk away from me on the beltway, OH HOW I WISH!!! :cheers:

[USAFPILOT]

I totally want to do it...save me one...how much power do you expect it to make on a stock LT5. It has to be the most cost efficient way to get big power from an LT5.

[GOLDCYLON]

Single or twin turbo project Ron? Whats the price point ?

[RHanselman]

Single or twin turbo project Ron? Whats the price point ?

Twin...

$10k for the base system.

I also have 18 LT1 Single Turbo systems. I'm going to mod one and then test it on both of my Ruby's. It may be perfect for a stock Z...

Cheers,
RH

[RHanselman]

how much power do you expect it to make on a stock LT5.

Look at the dyno sheet above. I believe it's at 5 psi boost.

Just look at the area under the torque curve!

[USAFPILOT]

damn 10K is still a little too rich formy blood.

[RHanselman]

damn 10K is still a little too rich formy blood.

The Single Turbo would be about half of that...

[XfireZ51]

Ron,

BTW, I am in Vegas this week, leaving Thursday am. staying at The Paris for conference. Let me know if you can come over for a drink.

Dominic

[tf95ZR1]

Ron,
BTW, I am in Vegas this week, leaving Thursday am. staying at The Paris for conference. Let me know if you can come over for a drink.
Dominic

Dom, I think he's in Dubai or somewhere exotic like that.
Wow, I know the whereabouts of forum members better
than that of my own kids!

[RHanselman]

Yep, Dubai...

Scheduled to be back on the 27th...

[RICKYRJ1]

Twin...

$10k for the base system.

I also have 18 LT1 Single Turbo systems. I'm going to mod one and then test it on both of my Ruby's. It may be perfect for a stock Z...

Cheers,
RH

What does the base system consist of? then also what would be above that if at all? 10k doesnt seem bad for that much power being added and assuming a safe reliable tune. what are you thinking HP #'s on the single set up? Hope this all works out for all parties envolved, it makes a great addition/option to our cars :Eagle:

[A1990]

I would be that to be a low boost $$$$. You will need to redo your bottom end and lower the compression and while your in there...etc, etc. etc...

Not sure if the $10k includes labor of any kind...

[RHanselman]

What does the base system consist of? then also what would be above that if at all? 10k doesnt seem bad for that much power being added and assuming a safe reliable tune. what are you thinking HP #'s on the single set up? Hope this all works out for all parties envolved, it makes a great addition/option to our cars :Eagle:

Off the top of my head...

The base system contains:
Stainless Steal Hot and cold pipes (CATs if needed)
Turbo's
Turbo Oiling system
Waste Gate
Blow-Off valve
Electric Harness
Hardware for the above

Options:
Intercooler
Exhaust Tips
Gages
Fuel Pump
Injectors
Raptor ECM
Headers

Right now, only option is to have Corey Henderson install the system. I think Ron said Corey is charging $1700 for the install but I could be a little off... I'll check again

The Single Turbo on a stock car should be around the same HP/TQ numbers as the stock dyno sheet above. Those numbers are from my stock 91 with twins pushing around 4 psi. All for around $5500...

[RHanselman]

I would be that to be a low boost $$$$. You will need to redo your bottom end and lower the compression and while your in there...etc, etc. etc...

Not sure if the $10k includes labor of any kind...

Yes, low boost. We think the max boost for a stock engine with the stock ECM should be no more than 5 psi. I believe Mat's car (single turbo on a stock engine) was running 6-8 psi and was getting 550HP but he eventually lost a head gasket. You'll have to ask him the specifics...

$10k does not include labor.

FYI - I'm using the stock crank and rods on my 374. The engine builder said the stock internals would good to 1000 HP. He did however perform some lightening and stress relieving on the rods. I believe all the engine work and parts for my 374 cost around $9500 even with Ron Woods Head Studs. The goal is to eventually up it to 15 psi...

[Locobob]

Arrrgggg! Really wish I had the money to do this, working and going to school part time isn't leaving me any extra cash to play with. I just love the sound of whooshing turbos!

[RHanselman]

Arrrgggg! Really wish I had the money to do this, working and going to school part time isn't leaving me any extra cash to play with. I just love the sound of whooshing turbos!

I'm sure we can work out a Lay away plan... ;-)

[USAFPILOT]

law away sounds good...just lay the turbos in my trunk and I will pay you in a couple years.

[RHanselman]

law away sounds good...just lay the turbos in my trunk and I will pay you in a couple years.

They go under the trunk! ;)

[USAFPILOT]

that works for me too

[RHanselman]

that works for me too

Give me a call and we'll work out the schedule...

[FU]

Very happy to see that you hooked up with Corey !

[Fully Vetted]

I'll be at Corey's getting a dyno tune next Wednesday. Is your car already there? Has he started the work yet?

You know, once you're complete with the 15 lbs of boost we have this little competition here in Texas called the Texas Mile...

[RHanselman]

I'll be at Corey's getting a dyno tune next Wednesday. Is your car already there? Has he started the work yet?

You know, once you're complete with the 15 lbs of boost we have this little competition here in Texas called the Texas Mile...

No, it's our customers car (Ron Bidwell.) Its a red '90 with a 368. I'm sure Corey will gladly give you the tour...

[Fully Vetted]

No, Our customers car is there. Its a red '90 with a 368. Im sure Corey will gladly give you the tour...


I'll be sure and check it out.

[USAFPILOT]

so how is that car progressing? If I ever wanted actually do this...would I have to scrap all of my current exhaust system? Its a B&B catback, and SW Long tube headers. Id like to see some pictures of what Corey is doing with that car.

[RHanselman]

so how is that car progressing? If I ever wanted actually do this...would I have to scrap all of my current exhaust system? Its a B&B catback, and SW Long tube headers. Id like to see some pictures of what Corey is doing with that car.

I haven't checked in a few weeks. Phase One for Ron's car is the engine build. Corey is modifying Ron's 368 for boost. I believe it's still in progress.

You would not scrap anything. You would sell your B&B and then use your headers and CAT's. Your headers may need a little modification but it shouldn't be much. We used the Jeal Headers during design.

I'll ask Corey for Pic's once he starts on the Turbo System.

Cheers,

[Hib Halverson]

Hey Rat...I just happened on this thread and was reading....can you share a little about what the "Raptor ECM".

[RHanselman]

Hey Rat...I just happened on this thread and was reading....can you share a little about what the "Raptor ECM".

Sure...

The goal was pretty simple. Provide an updated Plug and Play replacement ECM for all year C4 ZR-1's but with a twist...

1. Compatible with all Systems and Subsystems
2. Compatible with all current sensors
3. Incorporate all the newest technologies
4. Hi resolution, support Boost control, NOS, Meth Inj, COP, CNP, WBO2 and internal data logging
5. NO modifications to the current engine harness (excluding COP/CNP as an option of course...)
6. Incorporate all technologies that the Mega Squirt System already supports
7. Common interface for tuning with USB connectivity

We are on track for all of this and I'm sure the Mega Squirt Guys will surprise me with even more. The car was to be run with the prototype last week however I didn't get my Friday end ow week report. First time they missed a report but the prior reports have been promising...

I hope to have the first 10 production pieces mid next month.

Cheers,
Ron

[Hib Halverson]

Great combination of features!

I take it the Raptor ECM development grew out of your need for a better controller for your boosted engines?

[alnukem]

Subscribing!

[rbidwell]

Hi Ron,

Does Mega Squirt handle the electronics for the 4L80E automatic transmission?

Ron Bidwell

[Merlot566jka]

Sure...

The goal was pretty simple. Provide an updated Plug and Play replacement ECM for all year C4 ZR-1's but with a twist...

1. Compatible with all Systems and Subsystems
2. Compatible with all current sensors
3. Incorporate all the newest technologies
4. Hi resolution, support Boost control, NOS, Meth Inj, COP, CNP, WBO2 and internal data logging
5. NO modifications to the current engine harness (excluding COP/CNP of course...)
6. Incorporate all technologies that the Mega Squirt System already supports
7. Common interface for tuning with USB connectivity

We are on track for all of this and I'm sure the Mega Squirt Guys will surprise me with even more. The car was to be run with the prototype last week however I didn't get my Friday end ow week report. First time they missed a report but the prior reports have been promising...

I hope to have the first 10 production pieces mid next month.

Cheers,
Ron

By "subsystems" did you find a way to communicate with the CCM, ASR and EBTCM?

[rkreigh]

Sure...

The goal was pretty simple. Provide an updated Plug and Play replacement ECM for all year C4 ZR-1's but with a twist...

1. Compatible with all Systems and Subsystems
2. Compatible with all current sensors
3. Incorporate all the newest technologies
4. Hi resolution, support Boost control, NOS, Meth Inj, COP, CNP, WBO2 and internal data logging
5. NO modifications to the current engine harness (excluding COP/CNP of course...)
6. Incorporate all technologies that the Mega Squirt System already supports
7. Common interface for tuning with USB connectivity

We are on track for all of this and I'm sure the Mega Squirt Guys will surprise me with even more. The car was to be run with the prototype last week however I didn't get my Friday end ow week report. First time they missed a report but the prior reports have been promising...

I hope to have the first 10 production pieces mid next month.

Cheers,
Ron

the megasquirt is a great system. I have a suggestion. why not use the factory ecm, and just use the megasquirt with a wideband o2 sensor to control the secondaries. that way a nice big injector could be used on just the secondaries for boost with the nice part throttle characteristics of the factor tune.

I think the secondary injectors could be triggered via boost sensing, and integrated with the the factory tune with a bit less trouble by just using the megasquirt for WOT/under boost. LPE did this with the LINC computer on the TT cars and it seems to work very well and is less complicated.

worth a thought. taking the "secondaries away" from the stock ecm is ez enough, and a bit of fiddling with the factory calibration plus the nice tuning available from the megsquirt might make this combo work well with less trouble

see what corey thinks.

another option is just having the megasquirt run the fueling. by keeping the factory wiring and sensors, and sensors for the factory ecm and driving all the gauges and maybe just tapping into the TPS signal for the megsquirt speed density tune. the factory ecm would still control the spark timing via the memcal.

seems like full integration of the megasquirt with all the GM stuff might be the big challenge here.

as long as you give the LT5 what it wants in terms of spark and fuel tables at various loads, it won't know what's feeding it ;)

[A26B]

Ron,
One of the main considerations in the development was to make a replacement for the ECM, while at the same time integrating all of the latest technology and MegaSquirt features. The ECM is becoming very difficult and costly to find, all of which will only increase with time. Being designed as a plug & play look-a-like will also meet the requirements of the ZR-1 owners who prefer stock. A side benefit of no small value, is the entire new, Raptor/Megasquirt unit will probably cost in the neighborhood of what it would cost in installation alone to add-on any aftermarket controller.

[FU]

There are quite a few people looking at this Raptor/Megasquirt unit with much interest. This is a very exciting turn for our Z's :cheers:

[ZZZZZR1]

Very exciting stuff!

Not just the ECM, but the TT raptor!

:cheers:

David

[rkreigh]

a few of the local hot rodders I hang with have put megasquirt setups on their older v8 cars and I really am surprised how capable this system.

very cost effective and the tuning dashboard software is ez to use and every bit a capable as the high dollar big stuff and XFI systems

I'm not very handy with a soldering iron but I understand now you can get the systems "built and tested" for just 100 bucks more or so

I was thinking about playing around with one to put a blower and EFI on an old bb chevy but haven't gotten the engine off the stand and into the car yet

too many projects and not enough $$ or time

best of luck with the project. if you can make a megsquirt "plug and play" system, you will have really accomplished something great

the LT5 ecm isn't bad, but no where near as capable

I'd be interested in trying it out the the LSV to provide the wide band tuning capabilities and tame out the idle and emissions on the LSV

keep me posted! might give me a good excuse to drive down and see corey. I have my brother in law in San Antonio and I owe him a visit

iron @$$ ride to be sure!

[RHanselman]

Great combination of features!

I take it the Raptor ECM development grew out of your need for a better controller for your boosted engines?

Hib,

You are spot on... The idea grew out of the Turbo Project. It's much more than that now.

This should help us all...

FYI - My stock 93 is on their dyno this week so we are getting close...

Cheers,
Ron

[cvette98pacecar]

Ron, are you any closer to the completed vehicle?

[RHanselman]

Ron, are you any closer to the completed vehicle?

Yes, Corey pulled the engine last month and is in the process of rebuilding. He also has all the Raptor Turbo Piping on the shelf.

Here are some of the specifics:

Ron Bidwell's (customer) goal is 600 RWHP plus
Henderson Performance Low Compression 368
Twin Turbo Raptor System upgraded for a non-stock LT5 application
Custom IC from Henderson Performance
Raptor/Megasquirt ECM

Cheers,
Ron

[GOLDCYLON]

Wow talk about leaning forward..... If Corey is involved as Frank stated this is very exciting and give the LT5 more options in the future. :cheers:

[cvette98pacecar]

Yes, Corey pulled the engine last month and is in the process of rebuilding. He also has all the Raptor Turbo Piping on the shelf.

Here are some of the specifics:

Ron Bidwell's (customer) goal is 600 RWHP plus
Henderson Performance Low Compression 368
Twin Turbo Raptor System upgraded for a non-stock LT5 application
Custom IC from Henderson Performance
Raptor/Megasquirt ECM

Cheers,
Ron

Ron, cant wait to see the outcome. The Purple Aerobody is slated for TT treatment once I get my next two projects complete. Well one project the Shinoda complete and a finished Z that I have on my radar.
Story of my life, lots of ideas and a budget to deal with.

[rkreigh]

I have a nice LSV 390 that would need "freshening" soon.

like to install the big FBI liners for a TT 427

short stroke with a big piston and about 8.5 compression with LOTS of boost should work just fine. need the alchy injection to go with it. the megasquirt might help there too or ECS has a nice setup.

I really NEED a Twin Turbo ZR-1. I love my TT Z06, but the ZR-1 still has my heart. it just needs to be alot faster

I never thought I would say 500 rwhp isn't enough, but the ZR-1 it kinda heavy and the TT Z06 walks it pretty bad.

[ZZZZZR1]

Because of this ECM, I think many more will consider a TT option.

Myself included! Can't wait!

:cheers:

David

[RHanselman]

Words from the Megasquirt Guy's about being at BG this year.

"We are considering a fairly major presence there, including transporting our dyno for on site setup to facilitate on the spot sales and tuning services. We would also offer a presentation in an auditorium."

[RHanselman]

Because of this ECM, I think many more will consider a TT option.

Myself included! Can't wait!

:cheers:

David

David,

I'll be offering a package deal for Turbo Systems ordered with the new ECM. I'll think you'll be pleased with the price. I may be able to publish final pricing tomorrow...

FYI - I called to discuss your options. No answer so I left you a brief message...

Cheers,
Ron

[rkreigh]

TTT any updates??? Ron, also ask corey what he thinks of using the Stg II cams retimed for less overlap (should work pretty well)

I see AES has the "big closed deck" liners which might really help combined with studs from Ron Woods for HG sealing.

I'm curious if my TI rods would live at 900 hp, have to ask Graham about recommendations there.

thinking of going with a pair of 50 lb injectors as that would provide plenty of fuel with a pair of big bosche pumps in back.

the megasquirt can also control "alchy injection" which would be a great option to really crank the boost

works very well on the C5 TT tiger shark. now all I have to do is sell a kidney to afford all this!!

[Kevin]

kidney's go for about $24,000 on the black market. just sayin

[RHanselman]

TTT any updates??? Ron, also ask corey what he thinks of using the Stg II cams retimed for less overlap (should work pretty well)

I see AES has the "big closed deck" liners which might really help combined with studs from Ron Woods for HG sealing.


No real updates on the ECM. Stock Z is still on the dyno. They had some work stoppage issues. They didn't know about the noise the duel-mass could make when the engine is not hitting correctly. They are now edumacaateddd... As far as Ron's car goes, Corey is assembling the short block this week.

I do like the AES setup. I have Ron Woods studs in my TT now. Not sure if they would be needed with the AES setup but I'd think it would be good insurance... Yep, a low compression AES 427 would be nice...

[rkreigh]

AES advertises the mod for 8500 which I think might just be the liners installed in the block.

I need to get in touch with them. thinking also about their 390 LSx engine which works well for boost on the C5 platform.

any new developments? like to investigate the raptor megasquirt option for tuning on the LSV and maybe running e85 or at least doing an "emissions tune" will the megsquirt control and automatic tranny like to 480LE?

thanks!

[RHanselman]

AES advertises the mod for 8500 which I think might just be the liners installed in the block.

I need to get in touch with them. thinking also about their 390 LSx engine which works well for boost on the C5 platform.

any new developments? like to investigate the raptor megasquirt option for tuning on the LSV and maybe running e85 or at least doing an "emissions tune" will the megsquirt control and automatic tranny like to 480LE?

thanks!

Ron,

I believe Pete said an AES 401 was about $10k for the shortblock. $8500 sounds right for just the block work and liners.

Base tune at Megasquirt is still in progress. They had some questions because my ZF was making some rattle-can noises but that's now cleared up and they've continued their tuning efforts.

E85 is an option for our new ECM. We just need to crack the incompatibility with our fuel system nut...

Megasquirt offers an "add on" trans controller but it's not built-in to this ECM.

Cheers,
RH

[rkreigh]

I checked the AES site, the 8500 price is the machined block with the liners installed and choice of pistons.

10k really isn't too bad all things considered. I could like reuse the TI rods and billet crank as they are pretty strong parts.

is anyone "recoating" their main bearings??? mine are probably in pretty good shape and might be able to be reused, but I'd hate to get it apart and be stuck without the bearings

thanks for the update, good luck. that's good news about a tranny add in on the megasquirt. very cool.

[Jagdpanzer]

Ron,
I have a set of coated main bearings in the 402 I'm building. Used Calico Coating out of Denver, NC. They do excellent work. I have a spare set of coated mains on the shelf if you need them.

[RHanselman]

My 374 has coated main bearings as well. They were done local when I lived in Las Vegas...

[rkreigh]

good to know folks are having luck with recoated bearings

any updates on the growl from the raptor

how about a mega-raptor?? sounds like a good japanese monster and looking forward to a ZR-1 cracking that 800 rwhp barrier with something within my meager financial reach!

[RHanselman]

good to know folks are having luck with recoated bearings

any updates on the growl from the raptor

how about a mega-raptor?? sounds like a good japanese monster and looking forward to a ZR-1 cracking that 800 rwhp barrier with something within my meager financial reach!

Couple of updates...

Corey is waiting on pistons in order to complete Ron's motor.

Megasquirt will bring their Dyno to BG this year and demo the ECM and tuning. They will be giving a presentation in the auditorium as well... I'll also have some time allotted to talk about the Raptor Turbo System.

Things are coming together...

[GTOger]

FYI, last time we had our ZR-1 at Corey's, he was dishing a bit about this project. It really does sound fascinating, and it's certainly far from a "hey, let's toss some stuff on the motor" proposition. This is an honest-to-goodness engineered project. Pretty cool stuff when you consider the age of the cars and the interest that still surrounds them.

[-=Jeff=-]

How is the new ECM coming along?

Is it playing nice with the CCM?

[cvette98pacecar]

How is the new ECM coming along?

Is it playing nice with the CCM?

Jeff, I think you want the TT more than I do. :cheers:

[-=Jeff=-]

Jeff, I think you want the TT more than I do. :cheers:

NAH, more curious on the ECM piece of it honestly..

Although a TT would be nice

[RHanselman]

How is the new ECM coming along?

Is it playing nice with the CCM?

The report from Megasquirt on Monday said the car was still on the dyno. They are working the base tune.

Yes, the ECM is talking to the CCM. They've only sent test data between the two just to verify the connection and format. They'll work the packets next. Confidence is real high that this will not be an issue.

Corey Henderson spent some significant time with them discussing some particulars. We had some concerns on the 1990 MY (just for you Brett) because of the differences in Spark Control. We want to make sure this thing works with all years straight from the box...

The first ECM is going to Ron Bidwell and his car is a 1990. Corey will confirm all the functions and then tune for the twin turbo. We are still a few months from completion. I think we (Ron, Corey and Megasquirt) would like to have all completed before BG.

I have my fingers crossed!

Cheers,
Ron

[RHanselman]

Car is still on the Dyno however they haven't ran it for a few weeks. The software guys are trying to improve on the way the secondaries sequence in. They don't like the way GM did it... I guess it will take a firmware change from what I'm hearing. So now it's in the software engineers court.

Cheers,
Ron

[Tyler Townsley]

Car is still on the Dyno however they haven't ran it for a few weeks. The software guys are trying to improve on the way the secondaries sequence in. They don't like the way GM did it... I guess it will take a firmware change from what I'm hearing. So now it's in the software engineers court.

Cheers,
Ron

Probably do not like the way GM (adjusts) half's the primary injector flow and turns on the secondary injectors at that rate then applies the fuel table from there. Recommend they just make adjustments that turns on both injectors all the time as does Tod P in his modification of GMs code.

Tyler

[XfireZ51]

Probably do not like the way GM (adjusts) half's the primary injector flow and turns on the secondary injectors at that rate then applies the fuel table from there. Recommend they just make adjustments that turns on both injectors all the time as does Tod P in his modification of GMs code.

Tyler

Tyler,

R U saying Todd runs both injectors even at Closed Throttle? Stock code allows both injector ON after what is defined Closed Throttle in the cal. What would be the benefit of running both injectors, at half value, for idle?

[Tyler Townsley]

Tyler,

R U saying Todd runs both injectors even at Closed Throttle? Stock code allows both injector ON after what is defined Closed Throttle in the cal. What would be the benefit of running both injectors, at half value, for idle?

The stock calibration does not turn the secondary injectors unless it meets the parameters to go to the PE mode, I think it cuts the time to .57 of what is commanded when in single injector mode. You can also use this parameter to increase fuel if your PE table runs out of fuel. I recommended this to Jim Smith for that on Ron Ks car as he was leaning out on the dyno and would not respond to additional fuel increases in the PE table. It worked but he did have to go back to the PE table and pull some fuel out at top end.

My car calibration runs both injectors at all times. Throttle plates are removed. With the code mod you cannot jump back and forth. It does not matter whether you run one or 2 injectors you adjust the calibration in the code to meter whatever fuel is necessary, WOT or idle.

Tyler

[XfireZ51]

Car calibration runs both injectors at all times. Throttle plates are removed. With the code mod you cannot jump back and forth. It does not matter whether you run one or 2 injectors you adjust the calibration in the code to meter whatever fuel is necessary, WOT or idle.

Tyler

By "code mod" do you mean changes in the calibration values or modification to the ECM code. My motor has throttle plates removed, however at Closed Throttle, only the primary injector functions using VE Closed Throttle table.
I just want to understand what would be the benefit of running both injectors at Closed Throttle.

[Tyler Townsley]

By "code mod" do you mean changes in the calibration values or modification to the ECM code. My motor has throttle plates removed, however at Closed Throttle, only the primary injector functions using VE Closed Throttle table.
I just want to understand what would be the benefit of running both injectors at Closed Throttle.

Modification in the ECM code. If you do not do this mod you only run on both injectors in PE mode.

[tpepmeie]

Modification in the ECM code. If you do not do this mod you only run on both injectors in PE mode.

Don't want to hijack Ron's fantastic thread, but just to clarify... the table in the stock calibration, if set to zeros, will open the SPT's with a throttle position greater than but not equal to zero. To open them at zero, it is a very simple one byte change to the instruction set in the operating code.

It's not necessary to open them at idle, but if you choose to do it that's how.

[XfireZ51]

Don't want to hijack Ron's fantastic thread, but just to clarify... the table in the stock calibration, if set to zeros, will open the SPT's with a throttle position greater than but not equal to zero. To open them at zero, it is a very simple one byte change to the instruction set in the operating code.

It's not necessary to open them at idle, but if you choose to do it that's how.

Todd,

Couldn't you do that by what you define as Closed Throttle in the constants?
Also, wouldn't the pulse width need to be pretty small if using both injectors at idle?

[tpepmeie]

Todd,

Couldn't you do that by what you define as Closed Throttle in the constants?
Also, wouldn't the pulse width need to be pretty small if using both injectors at idle?

No, it is a straight up function of TPS %, nothing to do with the closed throttle constant.

the injectors have no problem controlling the pulse width even at idle.

[XfireZ51]

Todd,

Thx for the clarification.

[Tyler Townsley]

Todd,

Thx for the clarification.

Agree.

As always thanks Todd.

Tyler

[RHanselman]

Just a quick update...

I talked with both Corey and the MegaSquirt (MS) Guys yesterday:

Corey said the engine is together and in the car. They are starting to piece the Raptor Piping together and will need the Turbo's and associated materials in the next week or so. Corey is also sizing the turbo's for the 368.

MS said the Ruby should be off the dyno today. They've cracked the nut on the secondaries and are happy with the tune. Next comes some road testing. All is on track for them to be at BG. I'm flying into Atlanta the Sunday before BG so that I can join the group that's driving the Dragon's Tail.

BG - Both MS and I will be giving presentations. MS on the ECM and myself on the Raptor Turbo Systems LT1-5. FYI, both Corey and I are shooting to have Ron Bidwell's car finished for BG however the MS guy's may not be able to meet the timeline that Corey needs to tune the car. We're pushing but it is what it is...

All in all, we are very happy with the progress.

Cheers,
RH

[rkreigh]

are you guys using the megasquirt pro?

more people on LS1tech are cranking out big power with these little computers on turbo cars. the features and affordable price is fantastic

wish I could make BG, please post up details of the presentation and keep us posted.

the turbo ZR-1 and the raptor solutions are exciting stuff!

[Schrade]

Sure...

The goal was pretty simple. Provide an updated Plug and Play replacement ECM for all year C4 ZR-1's but with a twist...

1. Compatible with all Systems and Subsystems
2. Compatible with all current sensors
3. Incorporate all the newest technologies
4. Hi resolution, support Boost control, NOS, Meth Inj, COP, CNP, WBO2 and internal data logging
5. NO modifications to the current engine harness (excluding COP/CNP as an option of course...)
6. Incorporate all technologies that the Mega Squirt System already supports
7. Common interface for tuning with USB connectivity

We are on track for all of this and I'm sure the Mega Squirt Guys will surprise me with even more. The car was to be run with the prototype last week however I didn't get my Friday end ow week report. First time they missed a report but the prior reports have been promising...

I hope to have the first 10 production pieces mid next month.

Cheers,
Ron

By "subsystems" did you find a way to communicate with the CCM, ASR and EBTCM?

I'm curious too here; who did the coding? Was an original ECM code de-compiled? Or a new one written from scratch?

[RHanselman]

I'm curious too here; who did the coding? Was an original ECM code de-compiled? Or a new one written from scratch?

I don't know the answer so I sent an email asking. This might be a good question to ask during their presentation at BG.

Cheers,

[USAFPILOT]

this thing running yet?

[RHanselman]

ECM testing is finished. Now just awaiting parts and assembly of the production units.

Turbo car has the motor installed, turbo's are on the way and I believe the cold side piping is complete. Not sure if Corey has test fired the engine or not...

Almost complete with both...

[Tyler Townsley]

I'm curious too here; who did the coding? Was an original ECM code de-compiled? Or a new one written from scratch?

All you want to know.

http://www.megasquirt.info/

Tyler

[XfireZ51]

I'm curious too here; who did the coding? Was an original ECM code de-compiled? Or a new one written from scratch?

I would be surprised if this is not an adaptation of the basic MS operating code.
They already handle SD systems, NOS, forced induction, timing etc. They could develop an interface for the harness connectors for the ECM. Sorry I won't be there for the unveiling. Look forward to hearing more about how it works.

[Schrade]

Will MS tune software interface with a native ECM? (never mind writing to- and editing, but just for data logging)

(still reading there, but they mention only their own logic boards...)

FAQ page didn't cover that

ed.:
looks like it will not ...
the first thing you must do after loading code is set the ECU Type (under 'Fuel Set-Up/General') to match your hardware (MS-II™ or MicroSquirt® controller)

2ed.:
Lotta' help at their forums.
Tried to register, and got this error message:
The e-mail address you entered is not allowed to be used. HUH??? No gmail address can be used???
Note that AOL (and hotmail) email addresses are not allowed on these forums ... What about gmail??? They can give me a kiss BETWEEN the cheeks! :mad:

Nothing like wasting 40 minutes reading ...

[XfireZ51]

The point of this effort is to replace the OEM ECM, not work along side it. However, I haven't yet heard how the MS plays w the CCM.



Will MS tune software interface with a native ECM? (never mind writing to- and editing, but just for data logging)

(still reading there, but they mention only their own logic boards...)

FAQ page didn't cover that

ed.:
looks like it will not ...

2ed.:
Lotta' help at their forums.
Tried to register, and got this error message:
The e-mail address you entered is not allowed to be used. HUH??? No gmail address can be used???
What about gmail??? They can give me a kiss BETWEEN the cheeks! :mad:

[Schrade]

The point of this effort is to replace the OEM ECM, not work along side it. However, I haven't yet heard how the MS plays w the CCM.

Thanks there Dominic; I just unloaded $275 for Marc's memory/calibration module - not really interested in tossing good hardware here... Just looking for software for my laptop

[RHanselman]

Thanks there Dominic; I just unloaded $275 for Marc's memory/calibration module - not really interested in tossing good hardware here... Just looking for software for my laptop

Final tune is complete. It's 360 RWHP on a totally stock 405 hp car. This car has No porting and has the stock exhaust. They didn't mention the torque so I emailed them back for the answer.

BTW - The MS/Raptor ECM play's nicely with the CCM. This is not their typical ECM that you read about. It's their latest and greatest modified for our cars...

Cheers,

[FU]

This is the hottest new's to come out for the LT5 since it's start up. Period ! :cheers:

Hey Ron . I'd like to check out one of these when the 441 get's resurrected.

[XfireZ51]

Final tune is complete. It's 360 RWHP on a totally stock 405 hp car. This car has No porting and has the stock exhaust. They didn't mention the torque so I emailed them back for the answer.

BTW - The MS/Raptor ECM play's nicely with the CCM. This is not their typical ECM that you read about. It's their latest and greatest modified for our cars...

Cheers,

Will their be an .xdf available for TunerPro or a .tdf for TunerCat?
Does anyone have a dyno for a stock 405 motor using the stock ECM.?

[RHanselman]

Will their be an .xdf available for TunerPro or a .tdf for TunerCat?

Hello Ron,

The MSPNP will come with a program called TunerStudio to tune it. It does
not work with TunerCat or TunerPro - although if those guys want to modify
their software to work with our system, they can contact us for the
information. For more details on TunerStudio and its interface, visit
TunerStudio.com,

You can download the data logs by PC as well.

Thanks,

Matt Cramer
DIYAutoTune.com

[XfireZ51]

Thank you. Have visited TunerStudio site already.

[XfireZ51]

Ron,

Looking at the pic of the prototype, how much of the OEM ECM remains as part of the MS system, or are all the boards replaced?

[RHanselman]

All new boards. The connectors are the only recycled parts.

[rkreigh]

this is fantastic news. really exciting developments

now I just need to sell a few hot rods to be able to breathe some raptor fire

twin turbo zr-1 is still my dream car.

the twin turbo z06 is nice, and I love having it, but the TT LT5 is just that much more awesome in so many respects

keep us posted, can't wait to see what the raptor tt will do with this system tuned up.

love to do the alchy control with the raptor "squirt" also

I'd love to someday try an LT5 with two separate fuel systems. primary on pump gas, and the secondaries on race gas or E85

might be easier to just plumb in a 3rd injector on top of the plenum or do a custom intake with two fuel rails.

the guys a wheel to wheel build a twin rotex blown nova with the dual fuel and the car was absolutely awesome.

[Raptor Twin Turbo]

I'd like to try E-85 at some point...

Cheers,

[Raptor Twin Turbo]

Here's the final dyno run on the ECM.

Totally stock 93'

360 rwhp / 340 rwtq

http://i1132.photobucket.com/albums/m578/rhanselman/corvette356342.jpg

[XfireZ51]

If I am reading this graph correctly, the AFR looks lean until about 6000.

[Raptor Twin Turbo]

If I am reading this graph correctly, the AFR looks lean until about 6000.

Yes,

They said they'd be doing more tuning before BG. I thought they were done. Nice thing is the graph (except for the AFR) looks pretty typical for a stock 405 hp LT5 with an added 20 rwhp.

Cheers,

[FU]

looks pretty typical for a stock 405 hp LT5 with an added 20 rwhp.

Cheers,

Look's like a healthy 405.........could be some nice performance to be had with this setup.

Few thing's I like better than a very well tuned LT5 :cheers:

[rkreigh]

any updates on the raptor squirt (sorry)

been quiet since BG. Mark Horner is headed down to san antonio.

wish him welcome.

like to get down there myself to visit the turbo car with the new Raptor megasquirt solution.

the ls1 guys are having huge success with it on turbo implementations

integrating it with the factory dash is quite an accomplishment!

thanks for any updates

[Raptor Twin Turbo]

any updates on the raptor squirt (sorry)

been quiet since BG. Mark Horner is headed down to san antonio.

wish him welcome.

like to get down there myself to visit the turbo car with the new Raptor megasquirt solution.

the ls1 guys are having huge success with it on turbo implementations

integrating it with the factory dash is quite an accomplishment!

thanks for any updates

Hey Ron,

As far as the ECM goes we're just waiting on the 1990 car to be delivered to MS. They want to test the ECM on a 90 before release. George Jones is taking his car after the Holiday weekend. I feel we'll be ready within the next few weeks.

I think Corey is about ready as well and is waiting on the first ECM to tune Ron's car. Last I heard he was finishing up the custom intercooler so he has to be close...

Look for an update next week.

Cheers,
Ron

[Jagdpanzer]

Ron,
Can you please give us an update on the progress you are making with the first batch of production units?

[RHanselman]

Ron,
Can you please give us an update on the progress you are making with the first batch of production units?

You bet...

George Jones took his 90 to the MS Guys as scheduled. During our confidence testing we found a few issues. 1. The power switch functionality needed addressed and 2. The knock sensor functionality is different on the 90 than the rest.

So, they had to do a small redesign of the board and associated software. There is now a jumper setting on the board and 1990 specific software. All the units are configurable to work with all years however we'll sell the 90's pre configured from the factory. You will be able to reconfig if needed.

As for the Turbo Systems:

Corey has fabbed up all the remaining piping. We have 8 systems on the shelf. Ron's Bidwell's 1990 twin turbo is all but finished. The 1990 configured ECM was sent from MS to Corey today. So, we should have the second Raptor twin turbo running soonest!

Corey did some changes to the original cold side design and increased the size of the turbos in order to feed the low compression 368 at higher rpm's. i don't have pics yet but the IC sounds impresive...

We should have complete pricing on the turbo system soonest as well.

Cheers,
Ron

[rkreigh]

cool stuff. bob and I talked turbos quite a bit at carlisle this year

exciting stuff. good luck with getting them finalized. can't wait for the results!!

[cvette98pacecar]

I cant wait to see the finished product.

[Blue Flame Restorations]

Hats off to all those involved in this project. Simply amazing that we have a group of guys this talented. It takes alot to develop any product. Especially one like this!

:handshak:

[PhillipsLT5]

What a Journey, Ron !

[rkreigh]

time to boostamuv!