Water/Methanol Injection...

[Ccmano]

I'm curious if anyone has ever tried water/methanol injection on an LT5? It's supposed to significantly increase the octane rating (25%) and allow for much more agressive timing. Of all people, MAM is offering an electroncally controlled kit for $590. Thoughts....?
H
:cheers:

[jonszr1]

i believe that ron aka cuiesenarte vet had one on his car .spelling on his handle is most likely wrong. i wonder about using one also . sure would be nice not to have to back timing down due to fuel. corey made a very conservitive aproach to timing in tuning my cars to to ca ugly fuel . in fact i do 2 parts91 to 1 part 100 oct when i go to the strip .just to be safe .i have done this ever since popping a head gasket at the strip . i wonder if detonation plays a part in some of the head gasket problems that happen . maybe someone with motor motor expertise can chime in .

[LGAFF]

As you probably know this is used mainly on Supercharged engines.....funny this tech was used on WWII fighter planes as a way to get a short burst of power when in a dogfight. Would be interesting to try not, sure why the kit costs so much.....its actually a washer fluid injection system.

[Locobob]

As Lee stated water injection is typically used in forced induction applications. I haven't seen any hard evidence of it being effective on a naturally aspirated automotive engine. If anyone has such evidence lets see it.

[Ccmano]

From what I have read it has the same benefits for NA engines as it does for boosted engines. Particularly high compression engines. The key appears to be retuning the engine for more timing that would not be supported without the injection. Simply adding the system without retuning will do little or nothing.
There appear to be several benefits:
The water cools the air charge and makes it more dense, like driving your car on a cool morning. A major benefit to prevent heat soak on hot days or after running hard. This by itself allows for more timing.
The methanol has the effect of an octane booster. Several reports I've read state that it brings the effective octane to about 116. This is apparently the major factor in allowing for very advanced timing settings. It is claimed that engines up to 13 to 1 compression can run on 91octane pump gas without pinging and with full timing advance.
Modern systems now use electronic controllers based on MAF, vacuum or other electronic engine control criteria to progressively inject. Allowing for optimum tuning under all load conditions.

Attached is an article in HotRod magazine that examines the issue in todays context, in their case both for boosted engines and for high compression muscle car engines that their readers tend to have.
http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/engine/hrdp_0906_water_methanol_injection/index.html

Given the sensitivity of our engines to timing and heat soak, I suspect there may be some gains to be made. I know that chip tuning done by Dominic has shown that optimum timing advance cannot be reached on pump gas. This is because the pre-ignition sensor picks up ping and instantly retards the timing, this gets worse as the engine gets hot. In theory, this system should allow maximum usable timing advance without fear of engine damage due to pre-ignition. Couple that with a cold, dense air charge and what "SAE literature refers to as `micro explosions' as the water/methanol mix flashes to vapor that helps break up the fuel droplets even further, giving a more homogeneous charge in the combustion chamber." We may have something worth investigating further here.

I'd like to hear further discussion on this.
H
:cheers:

[jeasen]

I use alcohol injection on my Turbo Buick motor. It allows me to run over 20 pounds of boost on pump gas. 20 pounds of boost on a 8 to 1 compression ratio makes the compression ratio close to 20 to 1. So alcohol injection work well.
Instead of using alcohol injection has anyone considered running our LT5 motors on E85? It would seem to me that with 16 injectors all we would need is a chip burned for E85. E85 has way more octane then our 11 to 1 compression ratio would ever need so timing could be increased also. The new injectors work with alcohol so why not use E85?

[jonszr1]

how would one controll the amount of fluid that gets injected ? would it go off vacume or somehow patch into the computor?????

[Ccmano]

how would one controll the amount of fluid that gets injected ? would it go off vacume or somehow patch into the computor?????

Generally manifold pressure, rpm and in some cases injector duty cycle. Depends on the system. However, the basic systems simply use an on/off control. There is nothing progressive about them. Reach a certain boost level or manifold pressure and they turn on, drop below and they turn off. We're talking very small quantities, a fine mist.

There are two problems with ethanol. The first is simply availabilty. Outside the midwest, availability of E85 let alone straight ethanol is very limited. The second is the corrosive properties. While the newer injectors we install are good, the rest of the fuel system was never designed for it. Even today, new cars designated for E85 use have specialized fuel system components. I suppose it could however be done. E85 alone is 105 octane.
H
:cheers:

[Ccmano]

Here's a guy that killed his Honda engine off the Honda-Tech forum that was running E85. It corroded the aluminuim parts in the fuel system and fed that mess into the cylinders. Wouldn't want to do that with an LT5.
H
:cheers:

"I killed a set of brand new RC's, new aeromotive fuel pump, new aeromotive regulator, then the motor had more issues. After a bad leak down test I pulled the head the machine shop said there was white powder (Aluminum Oxide) was logded in the valve guides. You could clearly see the white powder on the intake valves and port. So I am about 2 grand into fixing E85 damage. The butt kicker is I put the car back on Cam2 110 and it made the exact same power as I did before.

Maybe I got some bad batches from Citgo, I don't know but the damage and possibly exploding decent $ motor wasn't worth the possible extra hp. After my experience a few locals have been dropping injectors ect. They all switch back to VP or Sunoco race fuels and make almost the same power.

I would like to see that same car above ran on some 110 on the same timing."

[LGAFF]

How about tunning 100LL AV fuel? It contains Toulene, which is a compound used to reduce knock....actually it is used in most octane boosters and can actually be purchased at any Sherman Williams paint store.

[Ccmano]

How about tunning 100LL AV fuel? It contains Toulene, which is a compound used to reduce knock....actually it is used in most octane boosters and can actually be purchased at any Sherman Williams paint store.

The beauty of the water/methanol injection is that it can be run on a DD, the fuel is easy to find, you don't use alot of it and it's cheap. Unless you want to find an airport every time you need gas it's not exactly practical. It's limited the 100 octane and it's leaded. There was a recent series of articles on fuels in Corvette Enthusiast, they explained the pros and cons of everything from E85 to AVGas to toluene to race gas. It's the Sept. to November issues.

http://editions.amospublishing.com/KPCV/Default.aspx?d=20091101&pagenum=70&f=

H
:cheers:

[jonszr1]

be carefull with toulene. its a very dry substance. and can cause gaskets to go away very quickly . i wouldnt use more than 8 oz per 10 gal of fuel .

[LGAFF]

Actually the airport gas station is the closest fueling station to my house.......I will read up on what you posted.

[Locobob]

Given the sensitivity of our engines to timing and heat soak, I suspect there may be some gains to be made. I know that chip tuning done by Dominic has shown that optimum timing advance cannot be reached on pump gas. This is because the pre-ignition sensor picks up ping and instantly retards the timing, this gets worse as the engine gets hot. In theory, this system should allow maximum usable timing advance without fear of engine damage due to pre-ignition. Couple that with a cold, dense air charge and what "SAE literature refers to as `micro explosions' as the water/methanol mix flashes to vapor that helps break up the fuel droplets even further, giving a more homogeneous charge in the combustion chamber." We may have something worth investigating further here.

I'd like to hear further discussion on this.
H
:cheers:

I suppose that is what it comes down to: Does the LT-5 significantly benefit from running more timing than is possible with pump gas. This would be a most interesting dyno/tuning experiment.

[Paul Workman]

YOu take me back a while, Hans. I fooled with water/Methanol back in the mid 80s; a 11.25:1 CR 427 BBC. When it worked, it worked! But, the control system was rude, crude, and socially unacceptable - unreliable and difficult to get "right".

What I took away from the whole deal was it had a lot of potential, but at least at the elementary level (read: cheap n crude) it wasn't practical (for me at that time). And, I wasn't fooling with timing so much as attempting to come up with a method of just running that beast on pump gas. It was a cantankerous SOB for sure, and in the end, I gave it up for lent. :rolleyes: That said, when it worked it was a beautiful thing!

Timing advance: With regardt to water/methanol, is advanced timing key to performance, or a necessity due to (much) slower burn rate?

I was reading about timing advance and the LT5 on pump gas. One of the points made was there was an optimum** timing. At some point advance became too much of a good thing - beyond which performance actually falls off. But, this is fodder for another thread, I suppose.

**Optimum timing was affected by the usual gang of suspects: engine temp, air temp, humidity, etc, etc.

Anywayz, tiz an interesting thread, Hanz. U taken the Z up to the Palomar Mt observatory yet? A nice twisty road for sure!

P.

[Ccmano]

As a follow up to the fuel conversation, here are all three of the CE articles. Excellent reading on the subject of gasoline, fuels and addatives. Noteworthy is the reference to a 95' ZR-1 used for octane booster testing (it worked) that subsequently had both cats fail at the same time.
H
:cheers:

http://editions.amospublishing.com/KPCV/Default.aspx?d=20090901&pagenum=52&f=

http://editions.amospublishing.com/KPCV/Default.aspx?d=20091001&pagenum=34&f=

http://editions.amospublishing.com/KPCV/Default.aspx?d=20091101&pagenum=70&f=

[xlr8nflorida]

I think it has potential, I was researching this today and then searched for it on this forum.

Some of the articles said 5% HP increase which seems like alot.

Some of it is corrosive etc. methanol and ethanol.

I think it has potential.....

We always want to squeeze all the HP out we can :cheers:

[todesengel]

I suggest anyone interested in doing this head over to supraforums and read the lengthy discussions, data posting, and input from people who use these systems everyday.

the snow kits (the only one I would ever use) are far from the kits of old. These are reliable beyond words, are completely metered, have built in safeguards, and warnings if you choose to use them.

I have three cars with snow kits on them, and have saved myself a fortune in fuel because of it.

Again, I highly suggest that anyone interested do their own research, and make their own decision, not utilizing second, third, or outdated source info.

BTW, a beautiful by product of using injection, if you use it correctly, is squeaky clean valves. I use direct runner injection, not single source, open nozzle in front of tb injection.

[xlr8nflorida]

Snow kit on a Mudstain

http://www.musclemustangfastfords.com/tech/mmfs_060064_snow_performance_ford_lightning/index.html

You tube video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFkvtlCNFQQ

Snow system looks pretty cool and you could use your windshield washer bottle.

[xlr8nflorida]

Per Marc H.

LT5's with the OE compression ratio of 11:1 are normally not detonation limited in terms of spark advance. That is, typically as spark advance is added the power drops off before the engine goes into detonation. A methanol injector will not make a difference, except.

If you want to run the car hard when the ambient temperature is over 90 degrees detonation can be a factor and methanol will help.

[todesengel]

Per Marc H.

LT5's with the OE compression ratio of 11:1 are normally not detonation limited in terms of spark advance. That is, typically as spark advance is added the power drops off before the engine goes into detonation. A methanol injector will not make a difference, except.

If you want to run the car hard when the ambient temperature is over 90 degrees detonation can be a factor and methanol will help.

That is an over simplification aimed at minimizing the attributes of methanol injection. That is to say it is locking the system into a one dimensional box.

If you add other variables, and this is just to add one, an actual true standalone ems, capable of more precise handling of the engine management, you will see good strides imho.

There are many more advantages to running meth that just preventing detonation. I run one on my direct injection audi rs4 to prevent carbon buildup on the valves. Carbon buildup is a well known horsepower robber in FSI engines, and can rob engines with as little as 20k miles of 50 hp or better.

I again reiterate my earlier statement for one to do their own research, and even try running one to give real world data. I am putting one on my lt-5 project, along with a ems, and between Pete and I, I can guarantee you will be updated on the results, as we have a sort of wager on the outcome of running a more modern ems on the engine.

BTW, for what it is worth, my audi rs4 is a n/a engine, and with installation of the snow methanol injection kit I picked up 18 awhp. With the additional loss through a awd platform compared with a rwd, if it was consistent (not claimed by me) between the two platforms you do the math. You should also be able to see the benefits of limiting carbon buildup.

[Locobob]

Stop working so much and get this experiment done Rob, want to see how this turns out :mrgreen::happy1:

From the tuning work we did on my 12-1 368 I know it did not want to take much more than stock timing without triggering retard on pump gas.

[todesengel]

Stop working so much and get this experiment done Rob, want to see how this turns out :mrgreen::happy1:

From the tuning work we did on my 12-1 368 I know it did not want to take much more than stock timing without triggering retard on pump gas.

Well this is how we are going to approach it this time Bob;

I am meeting Pete on Wednesday, and he is going to help me get my engine in condition for dropping into my 71 GTO.

I am going to install this with a haltech 2000 platinum ems. I am also going to install a snow injection kit.

I will baseline it without meth, with meth, then do the port work and tune without meth, then with, and so on.

The GTO will be a great testbed for everything I want to try with this powerplant with much less difficulty.

Oh, and jerry is once again front and center helping me as well :handshak:

I also think that once Pete plays with the haltech he will move to the darkside :D

[Locobob]

Well this is how we are going to approach it this time Bob;

I am meeting Pete on Wednesday, and he is going to help me get my engine in condition for dropping into my 71 GTO.

I am going to install this with a haltech 2000 platinum ems. I am also going to install a snow injection kit.

I will baseline it without meth, with meth, then do the port work and tune without meth, then with, and so on.

The GTO will be a great testbed for everything I want to try with this powerplant with much less difficulty.

Oh, and jerry is once again front and center helping me as well :handshak:

I also think that once Pete plays with the haltech he will move to the darkside :D

Okay now you really have my attention, this should be most interesting :cheers:

[-=Jeff=-]

I think Cuisinartvette had this on his LT5 when he had it

[xlr8nflorida]

I'd like it to work out! Can always use more hp.:cheers:

[todesengel]

I'd like it to work out! Can always use more hp.:cheers:

Ok, once again I am going to put my testicles on the chopping block.

I am not calling anyone a liar, or saying they do not know what they are talking about. The vast majority of you members have a ton more experience with this powerplant, and that counts for a lot.

The above being said, a lot of individuals are stuck in a time work. They tune on 20 year old technology, and the limits that it brings. If I am wrong I get to eat crow served by Pete, but I really do not think so. Although I do not have a ton of experience with the lt5 it is still a dohc air pump.

Pete thinks he will need a week or so with my engine. I want this done well before BG so I have a car that is worthy to drive to your meet, since my son will be taking HIS ZR-1.

[-=Jeff=-]

Pete as in ZR-1 Pete in the forum??

[todesengel]

Pete as in ZR-1 Pete in the forum??

Yup, as in chi-town, greek guy, ky Pete

[-=Jeff=-]

Yup, as in chi-town, greek guy, ky Pete

Okay, just trying to keep it straight (in my head)

Yeah I know Pete, known him for close to 12-13 years now, might even be 14..

Lost count.. Is he working his magic on your LT5 for you?

[todesengel]

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a260/chaosrob/149579_10150133972912715_829382714_8008184_6624805 _n.jpg

this is the test bed.

It will have a supra 3:12 independent rear setup, zf trans and stock lower lt-5. It will be run on a haltech 2000 platinum with ls1 coils. God save the queen

[-=Jeff=-]

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a260/chaosrob/149579_10150133972912715_829382714_8008184_6624805 _n.jpg

this is the test bed.

It will have a supra 3:12 independent rear setup, zf trans and stock lower lt-5. It will be run on a haltech 2000 platinum with ls1 coils. God save the queen

COOL Project

[todesengel]

Okay, just trying to keep it straight (in my head)

Yeah I know Pete, known him for close to 12-13 years now, might even be 14..

Lost count.. Is he working his magic on your LT5 for you?

One of the guides came loose in the motor and fricked up my drivers cam cover (spare motor). Pete is going to go over it for me, and put it back in a operable state while I am tending to my jobs early jan.

I may wind up going over the ems with him, and leaving the car with him for him to piddle with, and it would give everyone an independent source. I dunno exactly how it is all going to unfold in the long run, right now he is just helping me get it all together since I have limited time

[-=Jeff=-]

Cool Deal. That mean you will be in Chi-town tomorrow too then?

[todesengel]

Cool Deal. That mean you will be in Chi-town tomorrow too then?

No sir, I am leaving stl Wednesday Morning to meet with him.

[-=Jeff=-]

No sir, I am leaving stl Wednesday Morning to meet with him.

Ah sorry I thought you were here tomorrow..

Either way, Have a safe trip to meet him..

[todesengel]

Ah sorry I thought you were here tomorrow..

Either way, Have a safe trip to meet him..

ty, I shall try. I always tread lightly entering the State of Illinois

[Paul Workman]

ty, I shall try. I always tread lightly entering the State of Illinois

U B among friends below I-80 and west of IL 47. Its dem pipple inside "the Chi town square" ya...well...let's just say watch out fer! An doan fergit ol Pete is Greek! (Nuff said??);)

P.

[Tony Davila]

Any updates to this Water/ Meth Injection test?:dontknow:

[Tony Davila]

Okay guys I finally installed my Snow Performance Water Meth Injection system on my LT5. I have done my homework on the benefits, listen to the nay sayers.... heard that it is only for boosted vehicles etc. (What is a boosted vehicle but another means to increasing compression thus power.)

I ran my car WOT with it on and with it off. I will say I can definitely tell seat of the pants feel that there is more power with it on.
Engine mods are: ported heads, stage 1 cams, secondaries removed and Haibeck tune. Even though there is a little more power to be gained with an advancement in timing, or at least I have heard but not sure on LT5s. I decided not to tweak timing in the event I run low on boost juice.

My thinking is the benefits of a cool intake charge, cleans my pistons and allows my motor to give everything it has without the timing being retarded due to detonation. Below are pics on where I installed the pump and injector. Just thought I would share what I have done.:-D So if you were wondering or have any questions.....

http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/Meth1_zps5fb1ae13.jpg
Located the pump on floor, I used the stock C4 radiator overflow container. Painted it black crinkle and plummed it for the juice. It holds 1 gallon of boost juice.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/Meth2_zps6cfda69e.jpg
You will notice that I installed a on-off switch to the pump. This lets me test the system lights and switches and prevents it from coming on if I don't want it to.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/SwitchLED_zpsfd473380.jpg
Installed switches just below dash with power on LED (green). Red LED is my activation light.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/Vacuumswitch_zps41bd36d7.jpg
Vacuum activation switch fits nicely into fender and vacuum source to manifold.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/AirHornInj_zps0630f897.jpg
Tapped IAT port for injection of Meth and covered it to look factory.

[rkreigh]

cool stuff. I think running pure alchy would help on my engine as the CR has been bumped to 12-1.

but keep in mind the pent roof combustion chamber and dished pistons on the LT5 are very detonation resistant so the bottom line is that if your fuel and octane aren't detonating, you won't make much power.

we tried advancing timing on my motor and it didn't detonate, but it didn't make any more power either. the LPE calibration had like 31 degree and marc used 29 and it did just as well. LPE was hoping the engine would make a bit more power running race gas. wasn't needed.

no doubt that cleaning the carbon off and keeping everything clean will help the engine. one "bad side effect" of the LT5 is it tends to be a "carbon machine" and unless it gets enough time at WOT stretching it's legs, it tends to get carboned up.

from what I see on the direct injection engines, not having the fuel to help clean off the valves can be a real issue. so alchy injection into the intake to "rinse it off" makes alot of sense.

I run alchy injection on the TT Z06 and it allows me to crank the boost from 13 to 17 psi running pump gas. but the HP goes from 600 to 800 at the tires which honestly is more than I can hook up so it doesn't get used.

I'm going to run some through at a lower setting just to clean off the valves and pistons and see if it runs better as soon as we get some hot weather. (poor mans seafoam)

[ZZZZZR1]

Wow that's a clean install!

VERY NICE!!!

I need Frank to "approve" my car!

:cheers:

David

[Tony Davila]

Wow that's a clean install!

VERY NICE!!!

I need Frank to "approve" my car!

:cheers:

David

Thanks, I am working on getting some decals made before the gathering so that if you get the thumbs up from Frank W. you will get a decal. This is a joke from last year that we are bringing to life this year. My rough draft decal.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/FrankapproveddecalJPGsmall_zpsec713ee6.jpg

[CJ_ZR1]

Thanks, I am working on getting some decals made before the gathering so that if you get the thumbs up from Frank W. you will get a decal. This is a joke from last year that we are bringing to life this year. My rough draft decal.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/FrankapproveddecalJPG_zpse2492ceb.jpg

Love the decal Tony!

Can't wait for May :cheers:

[Daniel_Mc]

Tony,

Really nice install bro I'm anxious to see the dyno numbers. I think you are going to have a larger gain than you think. Like yourself and others have said its good to clean out the engine as well.

Daniel

[Tony Davila]

Thanks Daniel, I need to redyno my ride again with it on. I would like to know how much more I gain. But..... Dynos cost money and you need the time to do it so I will have to wait.

I'm telling you I feel the difference so I am a believer.:thumbsup:

[Hog]

Thanks Daniel, I need to redyno my ride again with it on. I would like to know how much more I gain. But..... Dynos cost money and you need the time to do it so I will have to wait.

I'm telling you I feel the difference so I am a believer.:thumbsup:
As with any mod, its nice to have a quantitative measure. Even 2 drag strip runs, 1 activated and 1 not activated. And see the resultant mph difference.

Glad it worked out for ya.

peace
Hog

[Tony Davila]

Thanks Hog, hopefully I can get a dyno run in before the Gathering to give more data for those that have contemplated installing a system.
:saluting:

[Tony Davila]

we tried advancing timing on my motor and it didn't detonate, but it didn't make any more power either. the LPE calibration had like 31 degree and marc used 29 and it did just as well. LPE was hoping the engine would make a bit more power running race gas. wasn't needed.


Thanks rkreigh, you just answered my question about adding more timing to gain more. Perhaps it is not necessary on the LT5 due to it's characteristics but may work better on LS motor. Just guessing......

[VetteVet]

Tony,

I'm not sure of how the control systems on these systems work, but you're not getting a valid vacuum signal by tying in upstream of the throttle plates at the IAT sensor location.

As load increases, plenum pressure rises, however at the air horn pressure is at it's highest at low load and decreases as load increases.

Don't know if this means anything or not. Just throwing it out there.

Jep

[Tony Davila]

Tony,

I'm not sure of how the control systems on these systems work, but you're not getting a valid vacuum signal by tying in upstream of the throttle plates at the IAT sensor location.

As load increases, plenum pressure rises, however at the air horn pressure is at it's highest at low load and decreases as load increases.

Don't know if this means anything or not. Just throwing it out there.

Jep

Hi Vette Vet, I have attached the diagram below. What you are talking about is not my vacuum source but where I am spraying my mist.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/Diagram_zps7a2aabac.jpg
This is the diagram that came with the Snow Performance Water/Meth Inj system.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/Nozzle_zps110dd2c5.jpg
A close up of where I installed the injector.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/AirHornInjinsideview_zpsd8114849.jpg
Inside view of the nozzle in the Air Horn.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/Vacuumackswitch_zps79014022.jpg
From the Vacuum activation switch I used manifold vacuum. I attached there because it was available due to no secondaries installed.

Hope this helps.

[rkreigh]

a couple of recommendations for you

even though it's super convenient to use that port on the throttle body I'd move it to the bottom and center it so the fan sprays straight down the throat and gives a better mixture/distribution. I'd use a silicone samco duct and just cut right in the center more towards the air filter to give the alchy the best suspension and more time to make the turns into the ports.

your way will probably work just fine, but I'm a purist and want to get the mixture as even as possible on all 8 cyl.

it might be overkill but I always worry about puddling injecting at a 90 deg angle to the airflow

also, spray pure meth. it will give you all the cooling you need and burn it all for more power. the water/meth mix will work well too but I think you'll be happier on pure alchy

good luck, great project.

[Tony Davila]

also, spray pure meth. it will give you all the cooling you need and burn it all for more power. the water/meth mix will work well too but I think you'll be happier on pure alchy


I'm doing research on the pure Meth solution. I might slowly add more alchy to my mix to a possible 75% Meth to 25% water and see how she performs. This is new to me so I need to be careful to not assume anything.

You are right the IAT port was convenient place to install the injector. If you could see how big the spray plum is when on and know that it is only activated at WOT, I think there will be no pooling problem because the Air Horn is tilted down. I will be careful though and thanks for your suggestions.

[VetteVet]

Hi Vette Vet, I have attached the diagram below. What you are talking about is not my vacuum source but where I am spraying my mist.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/Diagram_zps7a2aabac.jpg
This is the diagram that came with the Snow Performance Water/Meth Inj system.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/Nozzle_zps110dd2c5.jpg
A close up of where I installed the injector.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/AirHornInjinsideview_zpsd8114849.jpg
Inside view of the nozzle in the Air Horn.
http://i69.photobucket.com/albums/i66/Zrace1/Vacuumackswitch_zps79014022.jpg
From the Vacuum activation switch I used manifold vacuum. I attached there because it was available due to no secondaries installed.

Hope this helps.

Sorry, Tony. I misunderstood your description of the system. Makes more sense now.

Jep

[rkreigh]

I'm doing research on the pure Meth solution. I might slowly add more alchy to my mix to a possible 75% Meth to 25% water and see how she performs. This is new to me so I need to be careful to not assume anything.

You are right the IAT port was convenient place to install the injector. If you could see how big the spray plum is when on and know that it is only activated at WOT, I think there will be no pooling problem because the Air Horn is tilted down. I will be careful though and thanks for your suggestions.



tony, now that I look closer at the meth jet my idea wouldn't work anyway

great system, thanks for the write up. one weather gets better love to see back to back runs at the track to see how much MPH you pick up

back to back dyno runs would do it too. I'm betting there is about 20-30 hp available on pure meth

on the turbo cars, it's worth a ton and can almost eliminate the need for intercoolers (nice "liquid" intercooler)

on the turbo z06 I have I go from 600 rwhp at 13 psi to 800 rwhp at 17 psi on meth with pump gas probably a bit more boost would produce more but I run out of nerve at 800 :-D

[FU]

The alc./water inj. should work very nice when tuned into the new Mega-Raptor engine management system.

A good progressive shot of NO2 would be nice with the Mega-Raptor system too :-D

[Tony Davila]

The alc./water inj. should work very nice when tuned into the new Mega-Raptor engine management system.

A good progressive shot of NO2 would be nice with the Mega-Raptor system too :-D
Man I am excited about your endeavors.............

I have scheduled a dyno run for next Saturday the 2nd of Feb.

Test #1. Baseline run without Water\Meth
Test #2. Then run a 50\50 mix Water and Meth
Test #3. Then a 75%Meth\ 25% water

I'll post my results next Sunday, good or bad, then you decide for yourself whether it is worth it..